BigGameHunt.net Hunting Forums

[Don Fischer]

Is there any range that someone can shoot that you would concider un-ethical? Or is the any range you practice at a good answer?

I recently read where some people in Penn regularly shoot whitetails at 1400 yds and one guy is building a gun for 2500 yds. Good? Bad? Indifferent?

If you shoot at paper target's at say, 500 yds, does that make shooting at live game at 500 yds acceptable?

[Hammer1]

Very interesting topic Don.

The only deer that I shot and documented with GPS was 418 yards. Not a breeze, very rested shot, 270 reloads, broadside anddeer maybe went 25-30 yard.. BUT, the conditions were ideal, I knew my bullet drop and my built in ranfinder gave me a didtance of 450 yards. I took about four or five minutes before I actually took the shot. It was basically a benchrest shot.
I shot many at distance of 300 - 350 yard under almost ideal conditions.

500 yard would or should be a max distance .

Clint Eastwood, aka Dirty Harry Summed it up with " A man gotta know his own limitations"

[ChesterGolf]

I have a personal limit of maximum 400 yds. I can and do practice on a farm up to and beyond 1000 yds but shooting paper at 1000yds does not make it right to shoot animals at 1000yds. You can't wound paper targets. 3" low on a paper target is no big deal but on a deer you could be hitting a knee, brisket, etc. Can I shoot deer at 1000yds.... I'm sure I can but I'll never find out.

[avalonstudios]

In agreement with everything above, but take in to account the weapon you are using as well.

[Captain_Obvious]

A 243 can and will kill a whitetail deer at 400 yards. People seem to work it into their heads that because they're using a magnum or one of the short mags, they are suddenly blessed with superb marksmanship.

[fuzzybear]

This is going to be a repeat on ethical hunt practices.
I wonder how many reasons and rationals we'll hear this time around.
I can't justify shooting past 300 yds. with a rifle. If I sight my rifle trajectory at a maximum of 3.5" high. At 300 yds I will be 3.5" low. For a total of 7". The size of the kill zone. Even these super, go really fast rounds, will only extend that range by about 50 yds.
It takes a full second for a bullet to reach 1000 yds. A lot can happen in a full second. I'm sitting here in my favorite chair and counting. One million one. I visioned that deer I just shot at moved about 8 feet by the time the bullet reached him.
Most of my hunting is done with a long, recurve or compound bow. In order for me to take game. I need to be able to stalk within range of the bow. If I am able to get within 40 yds when bow hunting. I certainly can't justify shooting a rifle at extended ranges.

[Hammer1]

Good day again:
fuzzy bear wrote:
I can't justify shooting past 300 yds. with a rifle. If I sight my rifle trajectory at a maximum of 3.5" high. At 300 yds I will be 3.5" low. For a total of 7". The size of the kill zone. Even these super, go really fast rounds, will only extend that range by about 50 yds.
It takes a full second for a bullet to reach 1000 yds. A lot can happen in a full second. I'm sitting here in my favorite chair and counting. One million one. I visioned that deer I just shot at moved about 8 feet by the time the bullet reached him.
I couldn't disagree more.
Firstly, A flat shooting rifle(i"ll use the 270since my data sopports my 35 plus years of shooting and reloading this cartridge)
Zeroed at 200 yrs, - 2.5 @ 250 yds, -6.0 @ 300yrs, - 15.0 @ 400 yrd.
The depth of the body of a full size deer is approximately 18 inches. The base of the antlers of a motionless der is approximately 12 inches above the shoulders.That is the simpliest way to calculate holdover.
So with the aforementioned calculation, assumimg I'm accurate, placing the crosshairs halfway between antler base and shoulder, my bullet would hit center mass.
A lot can happen in a second?? And it is to the hunters advantage if used properly. A shrill whistle will freeze a deer motionless when he hears it. Sound travels about a quarter of the speed of a fast bullet. There's you perfect, motionless broadside shot!

AsI said before: " A man gotta know his own limitation" :


:D :D :D

[fuzzybear]

That would be the first rational.
Hammer. I'll take "assuming" as your key word.
Wow, 35 years. I'm impressed.

[rambo]

Last deer i took was with a 270 using 130 grain winchester silver tips. I was laying down in a field and the deer was walking towards me, It dropped instantly at 483 yards. Went right into the neck and hit all vitals except the stomach (thank god lol ) didnt ruin any meat. I was using a 3-9x scope and it was zoomed in at 6X when i shot. So shoot at what ever distance your comfortable with at the time.

[expatriate]

I don't think there's a number. Bottom line IMO is the maximum distance that 1) the shooter can reliably (and safely) hit the animal with a lethal shot, and 2) the bullet has sufficient energy remaining to do the job.

Everything else varies within those two issues -- shooter ability, conditions, and equipment. If you're shooting beyond your ability or are aiming at something that's too far away to identify in terms of legality or safety, I'd say it's unethical.

[RidgeRunner_07]

Wow tough subject....This year I took a nice little white-tail on the very last day of season. I am shooting a .270 WSM pushing 130 gr Nosler balistic tips. I was sitting on my *** on a hill side when he came out of the brush on the oppsite side of this little canyon and was running right at me. He stopped at 250 yds looking right at me. I was going to hive him a little time to settle down and turn broad side for a good shot....then he ran. I led him a foot and a half to two feet and torched her off. He dropped dead. The range finder said 300 yds to where he was when I shot.......not bragging but thats the best and longest shot I have ever made. In my mind the WSM's still give you nothing more than any other round. Other than high priced shells......34.99$ this year....I'm now reloading. I would have to agree that under ideal conditions is the only time to take a shot at any distance weather it's 100yds or weather it's 500yds....If you dont take your time and place a good shot your risking the chance of a wounded anamial. which nobody wants. I would have to say 500 yds is more than enough for long distace shooting at game anamials. The pic blow is my little deer I shot this year.

[Don Fischer]

So far the only one that got the question was fuzzy bear.

The question was, is there any range that someone could shoot that YOU FEEL IS UN-ETHICAL? Or is the any range you practice at a good answer?

Chester Golf summed up my feeling's pretty well when he said, "you can't wound paper target's". My feeling is paper target's don't bleed. I guess he get's it too but he doesn't really say at what point he'd concider someone else not being ethical.

I think that at some point, if we as a group don't decide what's ethical and what's not, the law will step in and decide it for us. We just may not like that.

CZ is out with a new rifle their claiming is a 500 yd rifle BUT they don't recommend shooting at that range. That they probally mean, but tossing the idea that "we got a rifle made for it" will likely increase sale's.

[remington]

Long shots take mucho practice. If you don't practice @ ranges you expect to shoot then don't shoot. There are many factors to take in when shooting distances. What one man thinks is ethical another may not. Put the average deer hunter next to David Tubbs.

[ChesterGolf]

To answer your question more directly. I feel 0-400yds to be reasonable, 400-600yds to be questionable, 600-750yds to be foolish, and 750+yds to be unethical but this is a hugely individual opinion.

Nobody, no matter what their opinion on LR shooting is, can say there is no range where it is unethical. Every caliber has a limit based on the power needed to actually be able the kill the animal.

[Don Fischer]

Fuzzy Bear was right about why I put it up there too. I was just curious if any one would take a stand against shooting beyond any particular range. Not many will even if it appear's they do think some thing's just shouldn't be done. Some guy's, not here got real indignate about a question like that. Seem's like they don't want anyone questioning their practices so they say nothing. One guy told me in private, again not here, that he can shoot 5" groups at 400 yds,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,off hand! Yet he imposes a 300 yd limit on his big game shooting. Then he said the guy's he hates are those that can't shoot at 100 yds. Well they can be taught to shoot! Some guy's can't be taught not to!

Anyway, I agree with Fuzzy Bear. I know that guy's do it farther and some on a regular basis, I used to do it myself. I'm getting older now and Chester Golf is right, "ya can't wound a paper target." I'll bet Fuzzy Bear has caught a lot of crap over his view. :thumbsup1: