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bitmasher · Joined: 27 Feb 2002 Posts: 2652 Location: Colorado

So let me get this straight. Your post has nothing to do with cockfighting (if you insist)? I thought in one of your other posts you were asking people to vote no on the cockfighting ban (SQ687)?

Your also stating that Allerd (sic) is in the back pocket of HSUS? Can you please give a link or reference to evidence of such?

It is not a secret that the Fund for Animals core goal is to ban all hunting.

bucknaked40 · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 130

Here you go BUDDY!(Top 16 HUSA Endorsed)
Senator Daniel Akaka (D-HI)
Senator Wayne Allard (R-CO)
Senator Barbara Boxer (D-CA)
Senator Richard Durbin (D-IL)
Senator Peter Fitzgerald (R-IL)
Senator Tom Harkin (D-IA)NEXT?
Senator Ted Kennedy (D-MA)
Senator John Kerry (D-MA)
Senator James Jeffords (R-VT)
Senator Carl Levin (D-MI)
Senator Joe Lieberman (D-CT)
Senator Jack Reed (D-RI)
Senator Harry Reid (D-NV)
Senator Robert C. Smith (R-NH) DEFEATED (no elected senator had been unseated in a primary since 1992)
Senator Robert Torricelli (D-NJ) DROPPED OUT OF RACE (Senate ethics committee had "severely admonished" him in July)
Senator Paul Wellstone (D-MN) DIED IN PLANE CRASH Oct. 25th
http://www.humaneusa.org/endor.....lators.htm

bucknaked40 · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 130

If you need any more info on any of these peckerwoods let me know!

powderburn · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 33 Location: Oklahoma

Buck,

I like to see a person who knows their buisness and you seem to be on the side of good. I am from Oklahoma and I am a hunter, the only difference in you and me is that I am a female. I am not offended by the cockfighting industry here in Oklahoma because I know first hand of the revenue that it generates for our economy. My only fear is that sportsmen...all sportsmen will not see the threat that the animal rights people bring to Oklahoma. Today the game fowl industry is the target but I feel that other sportsmen are on the hit list and don't know it.
Powder

bucknaked40 · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 130

Check this out:Wayne Pacelle, Senior Vice-President, formerly of Friends for Animals

"We have no ethical obligation to preserve the different breeds of livestock produced through selective breeding. ... One generation and out. We have no problem with the extinction of domestic animals. They are creations of human selective breeding." (Quoted in Animal People, May, 1993)

"If we could shut down all sport hunting in a moment, we would." (Quoted in "Impassioned Agitator," Associated Press, Dec. 30, 1991)

"Our goal is to get sport hunting in the same category as cock fighting and dog fighting. Our opponents say that hunting is a tradition. We say traditions can change." (Quoted in Bozeman Daily Chronicle, Oct. 8, 1991)

"Only 7% of Americans are hunters. That means there are more of us than there are of them. It is simply a matter of democracy. The majority rules in a democracy. We are going to use the ballot box and the democratic process to stop all hunting in the United States... We will take it species by species until all hunting is stopped in California. Then we will take it state by state." (Full Cry, October 1990)

bucknaked40 · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 130

Fund for Animals,Friends of Animals and Humane USA are all the same thing they are different branches of the HSUS.

bitmasher · Joined: 27 Feb 2002 Posts: 2652 Location: Colorado

Most intriguing Buck! Indeed, even though I had a hard time understanding you at first, things are coming together.

So your saying that Allard supports Humane USA, or at least takes money from them to vote in their corner?

Now what is the connection to the Fund for Animals? On the "About Us" page for the Humane USA (by the way I had never heard of this group until just now), its says that it is composed of leaders from the other animal rights groups (of which the most sinister is the Fund for Animals). Is their any other connection other than leadership?

Welcome to the board! Same to you Powderburn!

bitmasher · Joined: 27 Feb 2002 Posts: 2652 Location: Colorado

I'm confused on these Allard allegations. I don't see how the NRA (Heston made a trip to Denver to stump for Allard) can support a guy that would take money from animal rights groups thats public goal is to ban hunting?

Does that not stike anybody here as odd?

powderburn · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 33 Location: Oklahoma

Bit,
I am confused by it myself but I know that he is on the side to the Ar people or at least his wallet is. I have found that many people who endorse these political figures don't find out until it is to late that they are not who they thought they were. Powder

bitmasher · Joined: 27 Feb 2002 Posts: 2652 Location: Colorado

Powderburn,

I don't think you understand, the campaign between Strickland and Allard has been bloody negative, and the most blood spilled for Allard has been on his environmental record, which I admit is not so sterling.

Robert Redford came to town to explain why Allard is hell for the Earth Mother Gaia.

I have a piece of paper on my kitchen table, sent to me courtesy of the Democratic party, explaining exactly why Allard should be stopped or we all are going to be drinking sludge and breathing toxic fumes. I'm not making this up. Every environmental group that is anybody does not support Allard. Allard even openly supports drilling in ANWR (alaska national wildlife refuge) and repealing the ban on machine gun class weapons. If their is a poster-boy for the Green Movement it is not Wayne Allard.

Yet is there any more "green agenda" than that proposed by the Fund for Animals? Allard is a veterinarian by trade, perhaps that has something to do with it.

Wayne Allard may be against polutry-fighting (Good word Expatriate!), but I really, really don't think he supports a ban on hunting.

Note that I'm not a card carrying Republican, or even really trying to defend Mr. Allard. It just that what you are saying flies precisely in the face of 3 months of attack ads.

[ This Message was edited by: bitmasher on 2002-11-05 00:06 ]

powderburn · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 33 Location: Oklahoma

Bit,

All I know is that he was endorsed by the Humane USA.

I'm sorry but I feel like Buck on this. If you accept money from Ar people then you are buying into their propaganda. If you allow them to endorse you then you are on their side.

"only 7% of Americans are hunters. That means there are more of us than there are of them. It's simply a matter of democracy. The majority rules in a democracy. We are going to use the ballot box and the democratic process to stop all hunting in the United States...We will take it species by species until all hunting is stopped in California. Then we will take it state by state." statement made by Wayne Pacelle at the Tulsa Convention Center.

I just don't like anyone who will try and take away one of my rights. If I want to hunt, fish, rodeo or anything else that has to do with my animals I think that is my right as an American and these people need to be stopped.

Powder

bucknaked40 · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 130

I wrote Mr Wayne LaPierre a personal letter about this and never received a response from him. But here is the way it was explained to me. Hunting has nothing to do with your second ammendment right to bear arms. The NRA feels that he would uphold your right to bear arms or at least vote with the NRA but how he votes on animal issues has nothing to do with the NRA. You don't get PAC money from the HSUS unless they can count on your vote. Ever hear of COVERT actions and spies. Thanks Buck

expatriate · Joined: 26 Oct 2002 Posts: 1520 Location: Alaska

Wow, this one's busy.

I take issue with the statement that hunting has nothing to do with 2nd Amendment rights. Seems to me that outlawing arms would make it a whole lot more difficult to hunt. Granted, here in Alabama they have a spear season for deer (no kidding), but spears are also lethal weapons that would fall into the "arms" category.

It's politically impossible for the NRA to abandon hunting. If it did, it would lose its membership, its financial support, and most of its board of directors. In other words, it would cease to exist as a political force. Although the 2nd Amendment wasn't created to preserve hunting, the two are inextricably linked -- especially at the NRA.

As far as politicians go, how much PAC money and political clout does HSUS generate vs. the NRA? If I was an NRA-endorsed Republican running for office, I think I'd be reluctant to ally myself with HSUS and risk losing that support. But if a politician was shrewd enough to secure funding from such diametrically opposed parties, there's no telling what he could get done in Washington.

[ This Message was edited by: expatriate on 2002-11-05 06:17 ]

bucknaked40 · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 130

These people here sent Wayne Allard a questionare to fill out about sportsmen rights and it was never returned. Does that tell you something? 0 Days Until Election Day 2002!

Sportsmen’s and Animal Owner’s Voting Alliance
Full Endorsement List

http://saova.org/election.html

[ This Message was edited by: bucknaked40 on 2002-11-05 14:55 ]

bucknaked40 · Joined: 02 Nov 2002 Posts: 130

Also what if I am a cockfighter? I am also the grandson of a WW1 vet, the son of a WW2 vet, the father of a desert storm vet, and myself a Viet Nam veteran. I believe in GOD country and the boy scout oath that I took many years ago. The pledge of alliegence says ONE NATION UNDER GOD INDIVISIBLE WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. We are no longer one nation, we can't say god, the politicians have us divided by race, creed, religion, sexuality, smokers and non smokers,the corrupt courts don't apply the law equally and I have no liberty or freedom to pursue what I want to do. So I ask is this the America that our cock fighting gave us (George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and Abe Lincoln)? Thanks for every thing BUCK