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[DSR]

I was wonder if .308 win is big enough for a grizly?
can any one help me out with this?

[expatriate]

Has it been done? Yes.

Would I advise it? No.

Your best bet for griz is to break the shoulders and put 'em down in their tracks. I doubt the .308 has the power to do that, unless you're up close and personal -- and then I wouldn't want to have to rely on a .308.

If you use a .308, you're far more likely to have a wounded bear on your hands -- and nobody wants to go into the brush looking for one of those.

I got my brown bear (same species) last fall with a .300 WSM, and you just can't appreciate a grizzly's construction until you skin one out. The animal is a tank.

[DSR]

iam not planing on going hunting, i have an expadtion planed for the yukon (minning).
i would like to bring two guns with me a shotgun (benelii m4)& rifle.
i wanted to bring my springfield m1a. iam farily profiencnt with it. i can hit a playing card at 300 yrd standing and 600+ on a rest (adj. for win. & lev.) but not sure if it had the power for grizz.
thank you for the help..

[expatriate]

Just sent you a PM -- if you're thinking of defense, take the Benelli with Brenneke slugs.

[WesternHunter]

For protection lots of folks in Alaska carry .44 Rem Magnum revolvers or .454 Casul. There is some debate as to whether the revolver is to actually shoot the bear or to shoot ones self to avoid the horror before the bear mauls them to death ::-k

[expatriate]

True -- a lot of people up here carry handguns. But if you look at who's around bears a lot, you don't see handguns. You see 12 gauges. I don't know of any handgun that can punch an entrance hole the size of a nickel with 3,000 foot pounds of energy.

[george_ciprian86]

Here you have some good slugs.

http://www.sauvestre.com/index_us.htm

[expatriate]

Interesting concept that's no doubt devastating on deer, but not one I'd recommend for large bears. You need a round that with high weight retention that will penetrate. That's the good thing about the Brennekes -- where a lot of rounds are designed to open up to do tissue damage, the Brennekes don't.

I once helped my son with a science fair project where we fired various rounds into stacks of paper to study the relationship between energy, bullet weight, and penetration. He discovered firsthand that when a bullet comes apart it sheds its energy quickly and stops -- which is why a FMJ 7.62X39 round penetrated much farther than a .243 or .30-30 that had a lot higher energy and (in the case of the .30-30) heavier bullets.

Not a problem with the Brennekes -- the wad is even attached to the base of the slug. You might not get as much shallow damage in a lighter target, but when it comes to a heavy bear they'll keep going where other slugs break apart and stop.

[Widux]

Heed the words of Expatriate--when we rode horses in AK was only time we carried our 44's and for unsceduled dismounts only--otherwise I relied on my Marlin 1895 in 45/70 customized for scabbard.and close quarter work in 44 we carried 320Gr Hard cast bullets ala Elmer Keith.

[expatriate]

I just helped a friend get a 7-1/2 foot boar. He hit it in the shoulders broadside with a .325 WSM at 78 yards with a 200 grain Accubond. The slug went through both shoulders and lodged under the hide on the far side. The bear was getting his feet back under him when my buddy sent another round into the boiler room, and that did the trick.

A .325 is a pretty powerful round and the range was short -- but it still took two perfectly placed fatal hits to put it down. I still need to weigh the slug we recovered -- it had obviously shed a fair amount of weight. On the other hand, I shot my brownie last year at 125 yards with a .300 WSM using a 180 gr Barnes TSX and the round punched clean through. I believe Accubonds are designed to hold 70 percent of their weight, but TSX is designed to open up and still retain 100 percent.

Weight retention goes a long way when dealing with big bears.

[BDH]

Never bring a knife to a gun fight.

12 ga slugs are good in the right gun. A short barreled pump is best. Don't want a malfunction when Mr.Bear decides you're on the menu.

My son-in-law lives in North Pole AK and when we hunt in bear country we carry Marlin 1895G lever actions in .45-70 Govt. We only use ammo from Buffalo Big Bore (www.Buffalobore.com). Most websites have testimonials from customers...I am usually skeptical. The testimonials on this website are written by guides and professional hunters. I believe those guys. These rounds work. For regular Bambi type stuff we use 300 gr semi jacketed hollow points. When we go to Yogi bear's backyard we pack 405 gr or the new 500gr solids. Read the story about the guide who after his client pumped five .300 Win mag rounds into a brown he had to track the wounded bruin into the brush, It decided to charge him at almost point blank range. He dropped it at 11 paces with one shot from a Marlin 1895G and BBB's 405 gr solids. If you've got some extra time and have a good long distance plan you can call him and he'll tell you the story himself. I forgot to ask him if he had to change his drawers...

[expatriate]

By the way, I never posted the results of the Accubond's weight retention after going through that bear. As I said, it went through both shoulders at 78 yards and stopped under the hide on the far side. It started out 200 grains and weighed 133 after recovery -- 66.5 perccent weight retention. According to Nosler, the Accubond is designed to hold 60 - 70 percent of its weight, so it was right on the money.

Nevertheless, that's a third of the bullet's weight shed -- which is why I like the TSX for heavy stuff. There's a difference between kinetic energy and momentum, so a tougher bullet with less KE can often out-penetrate one that doesn't hold its weight. That's why my 180 gr TSX in a .300 WSM at 125 yards outpenetrated my friend's 200 gr Accubond out of a .325 at 78 yards, even though the .325 had at least ten percent more energy.

As has been pointed out here, heavy hard-cast bullets in a .45-70 can be devastating due to their ability to hang onto their weight and penetrate -- especially if they're coming out of a +P load like Buffalo Bore (Garrett Ammunition makes some impressive loads, too). The only problem is the trajectory -- it's not a long-range round.

[BDH]

You're right about the range on the .45-70 with the big bullets. Kind of like throwing a softball into the outfield from homeplate once you get past 200 yds. But at anything past 200 yds I'm headin' the other way unless I'm lucky enough to have a tag.

Inside 200 yds,in thick brush and limited visibility I want a round that will stop Yogi right in his tracks...I'll put Ben Gay on my shoulder later but at least they won't find pieces of me strewn up and down the riverbank.

You're also right about the Garrett hammerhead rounds. He has some very interesting test results on his website under the review section.

Never bring a knife to a gunfight

[expatriate]

I've been wanting to scratch that 1895G itch for years, but still haven't done it. There's only so many purchases I can get past the boss per year without tripping the circuit breaker. I've found it helps if I pay the jewelry tax, but that can double the cost of some purchases and even then doesn't always work. Maybe one day...

[JGant]

DSR wrote: I was wonder if .308 win is big enough for a grizly?
can any one help me out with this?

Just for asking such a question, I'd never go hunting with YOU.