BigGameHunt.net Hunting Forums

shakari · Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:00 am Post subject:

I started my PH career almost 30 years ago and one of the most important things I've learned in that time is that one of the most important things about choosing an African hunting safari is that quality is imperative. - My advice would be not to look at the cheapest hunt you can buy, but instead, choose the most expensive hunting safari you can possibly afford. If you were buying a car that you wanted to use on a daily basis and keep your and your family's life safe, you wouldn't buy a US$100 puddle jumper, you'd buy the best you can afford. - The same risks and the same choices need to be considered.

shakari · Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:15 am Post subject:

Let me add that if you can e-mail me at shakari3@mweb.co.za, I'll be happy to send you a copy of a piece I've written as part of a book that covers how you should choose an African hunting safari that's suitable for your needs.......

CVC · Joined: 04 Mar 2006 Posts: 1055 Location: Kansas

I agree that quality is extremely important and one shouldn't be "cheap" when it comes to planning a hunt. However, there is nothing wrong with comparing safaris to determine the best value.

Why pay more for the same hunt if you don't have to do it?

I compared outifts that offer the same quality of hunt and are highly reputable, but one is several thousands of dollars more - why pay it?

I think in the one situation, they are more expensive because they are frequently featured on TV.

Single Malt · Joined: 01 Nov 2007 Posts: 73

Shakari aren't you in the PH/owner/operator business yourself? Or are you a booking agent/
I don't have a problem if you are BUT you should disclose that type of thing before making suggestions of whom to book with....not that you did in your recent post but itlooks as though you're headed that way with the email suggestion.

shakari · Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 11:51 pm Post subject:

Single Malt

Yes, I'm a full time PH, own my own safari company that operates in a variety of African countries (biggest/most popular operation is in Tanzania). Most years, I spend 2-3 months a year hunting Botswana and 5-6 months a year hunting and guiding photo safaris in Tanzania, plus a few weeks hunting elsewhere and I write for a variety of hunting magazines, including African Sporting Gazette and African Hunter. (you might like to check the most recent ASG for an example of my work)........... which is why I began my post with the words 'I began my PH training almost 30 years ago'.

I wasn't trying to hide anything at all, but as I don't advertise here, I feel it's unfair to mention what I do for a living any more than necessary. (it's also against forum rules) - My company details are not in my signature line for the same reasons, but if you check my profile, you'll find my website address there. I understand that does comply with the forum rules.

If you re-read my post, I didn't make any suggestion as to who to book with, I just suggested I'd be happy to send a copy of a piece I've written as part of a book which addresses the subject of what to look for when selecting an African hunting safari suitable for your needs......... in fact, the article actually points out some circumstances where I wouldn't be the right PH for some clients....... it also talks about how to research safari companies and areas etc and how to decide what you want and can reasonably expect from a hunt etc.

My intention wasn't some kind of secret marketing ploy...... frankly, I don't need to do that. I've been in the business so long now, we don't advertise, we don't attend conventions, we don't make hunt donations and we hardly ever use agents........ and I still don't really have enough hours in the day to get everything done. All I was trying to do, was shed light on a subject that's very complicated...... esp for a first timer and always very expensive for the hunter....... it's always a shame to hear of someone spending a bucketful of money and ending up with an unsuitable safari........ All I was trying to do was be helpful and as always, I deliberately avoided any marketing............

The reason I asked to do it by e-mail, is that I can't send attachments by PM and not only would it be wrong to post the entire article here as that although it can be viewed as a stand alone article, it is in fact, part of a yet unfinished book....... If you like, you can send me your e-mail address and I'll be happy to send it to you - you can then read it and then come back on here and tell us if you consider it advertising or if you think it's been written in an unbiased fashion etc.

Hope that helps explain matters........ and also hope that it doesn't sound like I'm blowing my own trumpet...... but if I'm gonna explain things, I need to explain them fully! :thumbsup1:

Africanhunter1 · Joined: 24 Apr 2008 Posts: 6 Location: Canada

Single Malt,

Can you tell me which outfitters you can get a package deal for $4200. I would really like to check them out.

I have read all the responses and find it very interesting, I do agree that we must be carefull not to spend a bucket full of money that we don't need to. But I would definitely not go with an outfitter just because they are the cheapest around, because you are then more then likely to get "cheap" service as well in my opinion.

I have hunted with the guys I got the prices from for the past 10 years and know that whatever they charge will be worth it. I am not saying they can charge anything and I will pay it, but simply that they will have market related prices and will not try to make a quick $, but actually deliver a service beter than expected with exceptional trophies.

Single Malt · Joined: 01 Nov 2007 Posts: 73

check your messages

Tallone · Joined: 17 May 2008 Posts: 3 Location: Draper

Hi there,
Yes, this can be done! Try Namibia instead of SA.
I have taken a Gemsbok, Impala, Springbok, and Blue Wildebeest. My total for the hunt was right around where your friend said. And all 4 animals are gold medal quality!
I'm actually going back next year in June 09. I'm planning on going for a kudu, a hartabeest, a waterbuck, and a warthog. Anybody interested in going? I'd really like to travel with another hunter. PM me if you are interested!

Mark

HydroDes · Joined: 27 Jul 2008 Posts: 3 Location: Manitoba Canada

I want to hunt Africa, don't care where really. I thought it would have been awesome to bag one of the big cats. I’ve spent the last little while researching web sites and prices, economics decrees the big five are off my list. I hurt a little but I'll survive, there are lots of real nice plains animals to choose from.

I'm not rich; I earn a respectable salary as a hydro electric technician. I’m fifty and plan to retire by sixty. If, I'm going to fund this adventure of a life time, I'd just as soon do it while I'm on working man's wages. I've found two websites that have caught my interest, African Sky Safaris around $6000.00, ten days, 1 Kudu, 1 Impala, 1 Warthog, and 1 Blue Wildebeest. The other was Hunter's Quest International, a Botswana 7 day hunt for around $6000.00- Plains Game Package Trophy fees for one Eland, Kudu, and Gemsbuck & Wildebeest Included per hunter.

Not counting the flights to get there I was not too scared of the cost. I could see myself adding a zebra or one or two of the larger deer or antelopes. The big thing for me is having something to brag about back home at the cabin. I don't mind the odd European mount but I sure would like to see a shoulder mount of a couple of these babies... What can I expect for trophy cost getting them home? I don't understand the term dipping. Let say I wanted a couple of shoulder mounts back home how does on get them there without spoiling. Or does the process have happen in Africa and then the long wait to get them back to me.

I think I have a grasp of most of the costs. Would this be a reasonable expectation?
Air fare from Canada around $3500.00
Hunt Package around $6000.00
Tips and gratuities $500.00 to $1000.00 I did see somewhere to check with outfitter to see if hard to get items locally may be brought instead of cash.
Then what, $1500.00 to ship trophies back to Canada?

What have I missed?

HydroDes

Single Malt · Joined: 01 Nov 2007 Posts: 73

$6K is a bit high for a 5 animal PG hunt, even if we're talking about 3 of them being bigger 'lopes.
On an 8 day PG trip with the owner being the PH tips for the camp staff needn't be more than $125 and that isn't being cheap...the Rand is traded at 7:1. If the PH is hired and you have seen he gavve a great effort regardless of killing game $50/day is plenty whereas $100/day on a DG is about right.
Dip & Pack means after your trophies have gotten basic field prep they are taken to a taxidermist whom has cut a deal with the safari company to get trophies...he then dips them in a solution to kill any bacteria befor Packing them for shipping. He'll invoice you for his service an likely for the shipping as well..shipping costs today can't be estimated on what they were last year ;cause of the hike in oil but I seriously doubt you'll get them D&P plus shipped to a importer for $1500 anymore PLUS you're going to pay the importer a % of the frieght costs plus several more tack ons for his service THEN you pay shipping to your taxidermist....YES!!! the getting your trophies to your taxidermist after the hunt can easily run you 1/2 of the PG package price....SOMETHING few agents will tell you when you hear them claim.."you can hunt RSA or Na for 10 day for less than an elk hunt to New Mexico"...sure you can if you leave your trophies behind an don't spend anything else.
Hunting Africa never was cheap..though the last few years with the USA being weak ...air fare costs, freight costs...AND the general costs involved it has taken a hit.
IF you make your trip you'll soon learn EVERYONE has a hand out waiting for YOUR cash an is planning on making a buck off of you...SADLY!!! they don't bother to hide that anymore.
I've been to several countries in Africa hunting several times an after my 2 most recent trips have been left feeling like I was bent over and holding my ankles...BUT OH BOY!!! the hunting and landscape is truly addicting.

shakari · Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:45 am Post subject:

I don't really operate at the part of the market you're looking at but you might like to try my buddy Jaco Human at jacohu@mweb.co.za. Jaco is a very good PH, runs a good operation, is an honest man and will give you a fair deal. I can't remember his web address but I'm sure a quick google search on his name will find it for you.

Another option that might be well worth exploring is right in front of you and won't cost you a cent to investigate. The ads on the sides, top and bottom of the page are mostly hunting related so don't be afraid to click on 'em! :thumbsup1:

HydroDes · Joined: 27 Jul 2008 Posts: 3 Location: Manitoba Canada

Thanks for the info Single Malt

I’ve had a few of replies and they’ve very helpful. I’m fairly new to this message board stuff so it will take a little getting used to. Your last statement said it all. My ex-in-laws did three year tour of Zimbabwe for the same company I’m working for. I had just started working for this company when they went over, had I known then what my income potential was going to be I’d have borrowed the funds to take the four of us over there. At the time I thought it would be around twenty thousand which seemed like a pretty big sum in 1989. I have a few souvenirs from when they were there. I lost my more than my share in the divorce, now it’s time to get my own

With you answers and some of the other insights, I’ve starting to develop a plan. I still have lots of researching to do before I select an outfitter. I have thus far determined the quarry that I will seek out. They are as follows, Kudu, Baboon, Zebra, Giraffe, Impala, Warthog, Blesbuck, Gemsbok and Wildebeest. On average I tallied these animals to add up to $8,000.00 for trophy fees, plus or minus a few bucks. I think an average value for 1x1 PH at $275.00 per day for ten days $2,750.00. That’s something I’m not too sure about would a guy need ten days for the above list. Throw in $1,000.00 for misc items like tips, taxes, my firearm fees etc... Around $3,000.00 to get to there and another $2,500.00 for taxidermy fees and exporting. Then what I hope to see a, local taxidermy fee of around $3,000.00, add the whole carrot up, $20,000.00 plus or minus a grand. Ouch, ouch........Painful but surely worth the price of admission. I will start stashing my funds away, and start to carefully scrutinize the outfitters.

I like the sounds of a booking agent, are most reliable outfitters willing to go that route? All things said above do the PH fees and the trophy fees seem close. Also, with a list like the one above is it reasonable to ask an outfitter for a package price on I’ve selected above. What I’m getting at, since I’ve selected nine animals in total, maybe 15% of the list price as a bulk order. No offence intended I’m a product of my country and region; we always try to bargain on volume, that’s all.

HydroDes

HydroDes · Joined: 27 Jul 2008 Posts: 3 Location: Manitoba Canada

Thanks Shakari

I will check out your buddies web site and contact him if I can’t find it

HydroDes
:thumbsup1:

shakari · Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:43 am Post subject:

Always a pleasure to be of help. - If you can't get hold of him, send me an e-mail to my private address as shakari3@mweb.co.za and I'll call him and get his web address.............

Might I add one further small piece of advice? - If you do use an agent, make very sure you use a good one that has been in the business for some years and has an impeccable reputation.

All it takes nowadays for an agent to become an agent is one short visit to Africa and a quickly built website to represent his new found best friend in Africa and hey presto......... instant expert agent....... who probably doesn't even know which way is up.............. believe me, there's a lot of those types around nowadays. A good agent can be a great help - a bad one will do nothing but cause you endless problems.