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cam69conv · Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 651 Location: Summit, IL

LoL, Trust me Kevin, I have not nor would I ever state that I was all knowing. Just posted a few things that I found in research to csumerall in that post to help in answering a few of his questions. I dont find the need to blast off on people like some do on here. But I will defend with furvor when blatently attacked for no reason at all. He generated this post specificly to post his discontent with the things that I posted on the other thread and took things out of context (as I so showed). Dont know why he did it nor do I care, but the fact is that he jumped out at me personaly and stated blatent BS as fact by culling out parts of complete sentences that I stated in the other post to try to make his point of fiction. I made it plain and clear for a 2 year old to understand that the facts that I posted were not from personal knowledge of being there and that it was from research and from first hand knowledge of friends that have been there. I try to keep things clean and nice, but when someone just flat out calls you a moron (no he didnt state that exact thing but was STRONGLY implied) and tries to prove his point in the manner that he did then I have a tendency to get a little bit rude. As would anyone else I would imagine.

Now that being said,,, How was ya trip bud? Lottsa Hula dancers??? :\:D/

kevin davis · Joined: 23 Apr 2006 Posts: 302 Location: texas

i live in deep south texas, the land of BMWs (big mexican women).
hawaii has as many big women as we do, i think but the hula is more graceful than the two step. :D

cam69conv · Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 651 Location: Summit, IL

:laugh: :laugh: Yeah I remember from my several short stints at Pearl. Got some ummmm ummmm ummmm well BIGUNS to put it nicely. But there are some beauties to.

Don Fischer · Joined: 24 Mar 2005 Posts: 2137 Location: Antelope, Ore

kevin davis wrote: i live in deep south texas, the land of BMWs (big mexican women).
hawaii has as many big women as we do, i think but the hula is more graceful than the two step. :D

The hula requires a grass skirt. The two step requires a pair of tigh fittin' jeans. Tight butt's drive me nut's! :D

DUGABOY1 · Joined: 04 Jun 2006 Posts: 127 Location: USA

cam69conv wrote: LoL, Trust me Kevin, I have not nor would I ever state that I was all knowing. Just posted a few things that I found in research to csumerall in that post to help in answering a few of his questions. I dont find the need to blast off on people like some do on here. But I will defend with furvor when blatently attacked for no reason at all. He generated this post specificly to post his discontent with the things that I posted on the other thread and took things out of context (as I so showed). Dont know why he did it nor do I care, but the fact is that he jumped out at me personaly and stated blatent BS as fact by culling out parts of complete sentences that I stated in the other post to try to make his point of fiction. I made it plain and clear for a 2 year old to understand that the facts that I posted were not from personal knowledge of being there and that it was from research and from first hand knowledge of friends that have been there. I try to keep things clean and nice, but when someone just flat out calls you a moron (no he didnt state that exact thing but was STRONGLY implied) and tries to prove his point in the manner that he did then I have a tendency to get a little bit rude. As would anyone else I would imagine.

Now that being said,,, How was ya trip bud? Lottsa Hula dancers??? :\:D/

cam69conv something has me puzzeled, notice the two bold print passages form two of your posts,below, on different threads on the African hunting forum here! They seem to differ considerably! ::-k I wounder why!

I cut and pasted some of your EXPERIENCE below, and I copied the whole paragraph, from the one on this thread, and the whole post from the other one, so you have no excuse that your words taken out of context. From your post below I took from the paragraph, the sentance highlighted in BOLD print, and it is in dirrect opposition to your statement in the other thread cut&pasted from the string on Lever gun in Africa.

I would love to hear the explanation for the difference, in the two statements, which is true? I'm sure this is my mistake as well, and what you said in the lever action post, really is not different from the one in this thread. I'd like to ask you which is true, they can't both be?

Did you shoot a cape with a .444 lever gun, or is the truth you have never hunted, nor do you want to hunt Africa. This particularly confuses me, because for someone who has zero desire to hunt Africa, you can't seem to make up your mind whether you HAVE or HAVEN'T! I'm sure this discrepency is just someone takeing your words out of context again, and I'm sure you can clear it up easily!

Quote: by cam69conv posted Oct 29
As far as me not knowing about insects there buddy, I too have donated many a pints of blood to many pesky lil critters in my service with our nations Navy and been to every far corner on this planet. Just because I havent or do not plan to hunt in Africa doesnt mean I do not know some things or have the ability to do some simple research. Some that ask questions on here sometimes just do not have the right way to form a question on search engines to generate quality results. Not to mention Ive got tons of friends that are hunters and some have been, like you, to Africa on MANY safari so I get first hand info from them.

Quote: by cam69conv Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 1:25 pm Post subject:

What??!!!!!! you mean someone was allowed to hunt in Africa with less than a .375 H&H mag? Say it aint so!!! According to MANY, that 338 or that .270 just wouldnt be allowed by the PH's in Africa!! LOL Sorry just couldnt resist. I was just told the other day that I was foolish for downing a Cape with my .444. It just didnt have the "power" required for such an animal. I guess that Cape didnt know that since it dropped with one shot through the lungs. 150 yard shot and recoverd the 200 grain coreloc in the offside skin. Nice pics. As Im sure you gathered by now Im a devoted leverist (not so much that I dont own a bunch of bolters to though )

_________________Ya gots ta KILL it before ya can GRILL it!!!!!

::-k ::-k ::-k ::-k

[/b]

cam69conv · Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 651 Location: Summit, IL

For one I was mistaken and It was a large Waterbuff (not sure which breed though) And for 2 the thread to which I was referring was on a different subject... The buff wasnt in Africa but on a preserve here in the states. The guy had procured a male and a female for a client several months before and the client backed out. Since I was coming up with a friend anyway he asked me to bring my .444 because he was a little afraid that his .270 wouldnt accomplish the task. Said that the meat was supposed to be good on them but BOY was he WRONG ::yuk: Was absolutely the worst meat I ever cooked. Was cold hung for MANY days 12 or 14 I forget. Anyway It wasnt in Africa and like I said I havnt nor do I plan to. Just doesnt interest me. I go to Texas and a few other places every now and then but this one was up In Pa. I like the preserve hunts if they are on HUGE acreage because I do enjoy many of the exotics meat. Since you cant bring the meat home from where they are native, and ONLY if they have a large expance to live in like on most of the texas preserves are I hunt them there so that I may enjoy what I love. Wild game meat is the best you can eat as far as flavor and healthyness as you well know. Granted that Buff in Pa wasnt on a VAST place.. Only 500 acres but the owner is a friend of mine and to be perfectly honest he was scared to death of that sob. It had alread knocked him halfway accross one of the fields he was in and he flat out said he was lucky the beast didnt continue. Anyway thats what that was about. You are welcome to keep trying though Mac

cam69conv · Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 651 Location: Summit, IL

Actually Mac maybe you can Identify which breed it is. He SAID it was a cape and it sure looked like one on the hoof. The Boss and horn spread aint that big but it was supposidly only 7 years old and not troghy class. But I just dont know. May be a water buff may be just a small cape. Pic aint that great and its just the head and quarter of the cape laying on the ground in the SNOW oh yeah I told you it wasnt in africa didnt i LOL. It was 1582 pounds on the hoof and the ribs were HUGE and kinna overlapped like someone in the other thread said that a Capes is but like I said I aint no expert on the breed.

DUGABOY1 · Joined: 04 Jun 2006 Posts: 127 Location: USA

cam69conv wrote: For one I was mistaken and It was a large Waterbuff (not sure which breed though) And for 2 the thread to which I was referring was on a different subject... The buff wasnt in Africa but on a preserve here in the states. The guy had procured a male and a female for a client several months before and the client backed out. Since I was coming up with a friend anyway he asked me to bring my .444 because he was a little afraid that his .270 wouldnt accomplish the task. Said that the meat was supposed to be good on them but BOY was he WRONG ::yuk: Was absolutely the worst meat I ever cooked. Was cold hung for MANY days 12 or 14 I forget. Anyway It wasnt in Africa and like I said I havnt nor do I plan to. Just doesnt interest me. I go to Texas and a few other places every now and then but this one was up In Pa. I like the preserve hunts if they are on HUGE acreage because I do enjoy many of the exotics meat. Since you cant bring the meat home from where they are native, and ONLY if they have a large expance to live in like on most of the texas preserves are I hunt them there so that I may enjoy what I love. Wild game meat is the best you can eat as far as flavor and healthyness as you well know. Granted that Buff in Pa wasnt on a VAST place.. Only 500 acres but the owner is a friend of mine and to be perfectly honest he was scared to death of that sob. It had alread knocked him halfway accross one of the fields he was in and he flat out said he was lucky the beast didnt continue. Anyway thats what that was about. You are welcome to keep trying though Mac

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Son, you've got a credability problem! Now I bid you adue!

cam69conv · Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 651 Location: Summit, IL

See Mac... There ya go making hollow acusations and insulting someone and basicly calling me a god damn liar. Let me tell you something right now you classless sob. You asked a question in an insulting manner, basicly calling me a friggin liar then too. What did I do? I answerd you with the truth, and with total class and respectfulness. THEN you come back and say that IIIIIII have a credibility issue? You are welcome now to go straight to hell. You asked a question and was answered. Then like a small little 3 year old you want to come back with an insult because YET AGAIN your point and issue was put in the dirt. Face it man, people on here that know me, and there are MANY, know I have no issue with anyone unless they start an issue with me. Go change your diaper little boy. You want to act like a little 3 year old I shall treat you as such.

DUGABOY1 · Joined: 04 Jun 2006 Posts: 127 Location: USA

cam69conv wrote: See Mac... There ya go making hollow acusations and insulting someone and basicly calling me a god damn liar. Let me tell you something right now you classless sob. You asked a question in an insulting manner, basicly calling me a friggin liar then too. What did I do? I answerd you with the truth, and with total class and respectfulness. THEN you come back and say that IIIIIII have a credibility issue? You are welcome now to go straight to hell. You asked a question and was answered. Then like a small little 3 year old you want to come back with an insult because YET AGAIN your point and issue was put in the dirt. Face it man, people on here that know me, and there are MANY, know I have no issue with anyone unless they start an issue with me. Go change your diaper little boy. You want to act like a little 3 year old I shall treat you as such.

Well said cam, and in this case I deserved it! I tried to edit the post, as soon as I posted it, and thought about what I had said, but you answered it too quickly. And I admit the statement was uncalled for!

The buffalo hide in your picture is a Philappino water Buffalo! It looks nothing like a Cape Buffalo, however! The type of water Buffalo in most of Asia have the large sweeping horns, some over 100 inches wide, and have a body size 1/3rd larger than the Cape Buffalo of Africa,yet are much easier to kill cleanly, and the Eastern European water buffalo which is where the ones in the philappiens came from.

cam69conv · Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 651 Location: Summit, IL

Apology accepted. Knew it wasnt like an Aussie water buff.. Seen to many of them on tv to know it wasnt that. I guess the Curled up hornes and Bosses, plus the fact the critter was meaner than a molting snake and color was relitivly the same and it was HUGE (to me 1582 pounds aint no lil skipper) and the Fact that he was under the inpression, since thats what he orderd from , I think the animal was raised in Florida, that it was a cape. Didnt know nor really care, was just doing it as a favor and hey I look at it like this, Had the meat been worth a well diggers butt, I would have gotten a HECK of a lot of meat for 500 bux!!! Ended up giving it all away. Was a good test for that old .444 wich everyone seems to think wont penetrate a huge beast!!!

cam69conv · Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 651 Location: Summit, IL

Oh yeah... heres 2 pics of the bullet I recovered in the offside skin.

kevin davis · Joined: 23 Apr 2006 Posts: 302 Location: texas

that is definitely a water buffalo. the one i shot had a nearly yellow color but the same tightly curled horns. they were a nasty group, charging the truck and being obnoxious. i used a .376 on mine. but that is in the exotic forum. 8-)

maddenwh · Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 12:27 am Post subject:

Cam- Is this the "cape buffalo" you took down with one shot of a 444 marlin? At least you've finally admitted that it wasn't a cape buffalo. Good job MAC, I couldn't ever get him to admit that. The water buffalo of yours looks sort of like a sickly mexican yearling I had to kill a couple of years ago with a .22. I'm not surprised it dropped to a 444.

I remember this discussion also... You said that cape buff aren't as tough as everyone says and that a shot to the lungs will drop anything immediately. I believe you also said the 444 was all you needed for cape buff. Have you admitted to being wrong there yet as well? :yes:

SO cam69, let me ask, at what point did you realize you hadn't killed a cape buff. If you read some of your quotes below, you'll notice that on a few occasions you claim that you are a well versed and accomplished hunter and that you would have to teach me something about animal anatomy. I don't need to point out the irony here. I've listed some of my other favorite quotes you've made below (all were directed towards me b/c I didn't believe that he had shot a cape buff with one shot from a 444).

My final question, and reason for posting this, is that I want to know if you still think that a "well versed" hunter like you would have no problem hunting a cape buff with a 444. I'm also curious if you still hold the same opinions that the caliber minimum requisites in Africa were made for rich white people that don't know what they're doing?

"Yeah I love my .444.... She's my goto gun. Hit a Cape Buff at 150 yards with it right behind the shoulder and retrieved the bullet in the off side skin"

"I do love it when people say that it wouldnt be a good weapon in Africa. I just laugh when I think about how it folded up when that 200 grainer slapped it. Collapsed lungs will kill any critter on legs. I just dont feel the need for anything bigger"

"But no matter if you hit them with 500 grains or 200 grains if you pop both the lungs you will get the same result. DEAD. They main reason they want a .375 HHmag or bigger is in case of a charge and they have some thick sculls and that power is needed to penetrate them. "

"Ill clue you in on a little secret. The main reason they have that minimum set so high is because of the inexperiance that many have when going to Africa on safari. Bunch of rich folks that have no real clue about hunting or shooting at live game so the extra power is felt needed. I know this to be fact"

"The .444 is a very powerful and most are extreamly accurate and all thats needed in North America. I personally would not be afraid to hunt anything anywhere with it but im an accomplished marksman and well versed on live game shooting."

"Cape Buff, Live weight 1582 pounds, Yardage -152 yards (stepped off) Weapon -Marlin .444, Bullet- 200 grain coreloc (was before I got the dies to reload for this caliber) Damage- Straight through both lungs, Follow up shot NONE, time before it fell- about 30 seconds, actions it took before dropping- Not a damn thing except standing there spewing blood out its nose and mouth."

AND MY FAVORITE

"when you have hunted 1/16th as many game animals on this planet you may speak, until then you may wish to shut up and learn a little bit."

Looks like I was right and you were wrong CAM69. I just want an admission here :thumbsup1:

cam69conv · Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 651 Location: Summit, IL

Ok Number one this topic was discussed LONG ago so you must be wanting to start a lil fight... Been on the sauce a little tonight?? What you saw on the Pic I posted was in fact a phillipino water buff which in fact is LARGER on average than a Cape!! As MAC said!!! If you actually READ this entire post your ignorant self would have seen this!!! The Philli Buff isnt known for the out and out right MEANESS of a cape but its size and general body toughness are around the same AS OTHERS HAVE SAID HERE... Read before you post and stop trying to pick there lil one... I already admitted LONG ago that I was understandable mistaken on the type of buff it was and on the post that all that started with between you and I on the hog forum!! Learn to read!!... But the fact still remains that its still a VERY tough hided and densly boned creature JUST LIKE THE CAPE with an ,on average, LARGER body size... So now lil one... Tell me that a .444 wont bring down a biggun?? The Pic I posted BTW is JUST the Head and cape to the top of the shoulders... Want to start a fight lil one you best pick on someone that dont fire back!!! Mac and I have BOTH apologized to each other for the mistake and HE is the one that showed me what type of Buff in actuallity it was... Learn to read before you POST!!! LMAO at someone trying to say a 1582 pound animal was a sickly yearling... Im laughing HARD now!!!