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RMulhern · Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 120 Location: North Louisiana

Here's my 14 year old nephew John with his first group fired from 900 yds. yds. with one of my rifles! John called his first shot slightly left and you can see where that one hit over at the 9 o/clock side! His next two were slightly high in the ten ring plate so I gave him 1 MOA down....and he proceeded to shoot 5 shots into a group you could cover with the palm of your hand! Rifle is my old NRA Match Rifle in 30/06 I put into a .458 Winchester stock and bedded with MarineTex. Load was 56 gr. IMR 4350 using a 180 gr. Scirocco bullet with BR-2 primers! John....shows promise!

http://i17.photobucket.com/alb.....00-yds.jpg

Don Fischer · Joined: 24 Mar 2005 Posts: 2137 Location: Antelope, Ore

I guess my eye's are getting bad. Hard to pick out the individual shot's, take your word for it. It is great that your taking the time with your nephew rather than leaving him to discover these things himself. I believe that this "nation of riflemen" has surely slipped. A group at that range that can be covered with the hand is no small feat.

By the way, what is the dia. of that target? I may try that ultra long range some day.

halvtaz · Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 10:52 am Post subject:

That is some good shooting. He sure does show some promise. :yes:

RMulhern · Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 120 Location: North Louisiana

Don Fischer wrote: I guess my eye's are getting bad. Hard to pick out the individual shot's, take your word for it. It is great that your taking the time with your nephew rather than leaving him to discover these things himself. I believe that this "nation of riflemen" has surely slipped. A group at that range that can be covered with the hand is no small feat.

By the way, what is the dia. of that target? I may try that ultra long range some day.

Don

Those group of shots are such that the one bright spot over on the left side toward the inside of that black bull is his 1st shot and there are two shots up at the top of the group that's centered up for wind! Then what looks to be 3 bright spots toward center are actually 5 bullet strikes with two rounds atop another! There are two plates there.....one 44" diameter which is the same diameter of the 1000 yd.. LR target we shoot Palma/Creedmoor on and there's another 'raised plate' in the center that's 20" diameter which is the diameter of the 10 ring! It's difficult to see the smaller 10 ring plate but it's about 2" above the larger black plate! I train on this target shooting my Palma rifle and also my 1874 Sharps in .45/110 because the bullet strikes show up like a 5 carat diamond in a Billy Goats arse looking through a sportting scope and that way I don't have to have a target puller! My zero didn't quite work out for John's eye so he fired 3 sighters before getting a final zero! Shooting on this type target has saved me much misery over the years because as I stated....I do not have to have a target puller and I can shoot therefore any time I choose to! :yes: :yes:

Don Fischer · Joined: 24 Mar 2005 Posts: 2137 Location: Antelope, Ore

Mr Mulhern,

I have one more question if you don't mind. I realize that the scope is shimed on the front base to bottom out the elevation adjustment but I have never heard what power scope you use. It would seem that if to much power were used, mirrage would play the devil with you. Also that if not enough were used that the cross wires would render the aiming point fairly useless. Where are we at here?

Thanks,

Don

RMulhern · Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 120 Location: North Louisiana

Don Fischer wrote: Mr Mulhern,

I have one more question if you don't mind. I realize that the scope is shimed on the front base to bottom out the elevation adjustment but I have never heard what power scope you use. It would seem that if to much power were used, mirrage would play the devil with you. Also that if not enough were used that the cross wires would render the aiming point fairly useless. Where are we at here?

Thanks,

Don

Don

No.....the scope IS NOT shimmed! I have Baer mounts on this rifle which automatically give me an additional 20 MOA elevation so as to have maximum elevation adjustment within the scope which has target knobs. Maximum elevation adjustment can only be had with a 30MM tube I might add and if one wants A WHOLE LOT of adjustment without using Baer mounts...one must go to the M4 line of scopes that Leupold makes! If memory serves me correctly...that line will go to 140 MOA adjustment! The scope is a 6.5 x 20x50MM and I never go over about 6X when shooting! I seldom use a scope when shooting during the warmer months because I've gone from a hunting mode....to a target rifle mode during Spring/Summer months and shooting nothing but aperture sights on my Sharps/HiWall rifles! Mirage isn't nearly as big a problem in the winter/cold months but in further statement.....I could go up to 12-16X if I wanted and the reticule DOES NOT interfere with holding on where I want POI to be! For those individuals that may be interested....it's imperative, if one wants to obtain maximum elevation adjustment on their scopes, time must be taken to get the reticule 'centered up' and this is most easily done by moving the windage adjustment knob all the way to one side and then counting it back in the opposite direction to full stoppage! Then....count back 1/2 of the total movement to get the reticule to center! One can then start obtaining a zero and this is easily done using a rear mount with windage adjustment! Just use the mount windage screws to obtain say a 200 yd. wind zero! Done in this manner the scope elevation will 'track' from 12 o/clock to 6 o/clock! If not done.....maximum elevation will not be obtained as the scope will 'track' from say.......2 o/clock to 4 o/clock only!!
:](*,) :](*,)
FWIW!!

Oh...it would be best if you refer to me as "Rick"! Don't make me feel any older than I am!! :lol: :lol:

ChesterGolf · Joined: 17 Aug 2002 Posts: 1624 Location: Nova Scotia

Tell John excellent shooting. How long have you been working with him Rick?

RMulhern · Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 120 Location: North Louisiana

ChesterGolf wrote: Tell John excellent shooting. How long have you been working with him Rick?

Chester

That one afternoon is all. We had about a two hour session that afternoon on the range! John is one of those gifted kids.....whereby when he's told something....he doesn't forget and he applies what he's been told! Also.....he's 'new outa the box' so to speak....totally open to input.....and I'd rather work aka instruct a person whom doesn't know 'beans' about shooting than one whom thinks that they know it all! That way....there's no bad habits to have to unlearn!! John has Special Forces on his mind so when he's 18....he'll be seeing Uncle Sam! He's already training and running his arse off each day! I told him....."You can't run....too much then"!! :yes: :yes:

redrider · Joined: 20 Mar 2006 Posts: 2529 Location: NE Kansas

Sounds like he's a real Natural :yes:

RMulhern · Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 120 Location: North Louisiana

redrider wrote: Sounds like he's a real Natural :yes:

redrider

No....they're NO NATURALS! Shooting is a 'learned skill' and John has a long way yet to go to make a shooter! He's coming here for Christmas in about a week so I'm quite certain he'll desire further instruction! I've already got his ammo loaded!

Oh....MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL!!

bitmasher · Joined: 27 Feb 2002 Posts: 2645 Location: Colorado

The Leupold M4 line of scopes has become quite broad. To get the wide moa range (140), you have to go with one of the fixed power (16x usually). The variables are nice, but something about variable objective limits the end to end moa adjustment. The M4 variables tend to have 70 to 90 moa at the top end.

The other way around the scope adjustment issue is just to push a bigger bullet faster. For instance the 338 caliber 300gr Sierra matchking, with a 3000fps mz velocity only has around 22 moa of drop at 1000yard with a 100 yard zero. 22 moa is within the reach of less expensive scopes than the M4.

RMulhern · Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 120 Location: North Louisiana

bitmasher wrote: The Leupold M4 line of scopes has become quite broad. To get the wide moa range (140), you have to go with one of the fixed power (16x usually). The variables are nice, but something about variable objective limits the end to end moa adjustment. The M4 variables tend to have 70 to 90 moa at the top end.

The other way around the scope adjustment issue is just to push a bigger bullet faster. For instance the 338 caliber 300gr Sierra matchking, with a 3000fps mz velocity only has around 22 moa of drop at 1000yard with a 100 yard zero. 22 moa is within the reach of less expensive scopes than the M4.

bitmasher

How bout this?

http://www.military.com/soldie.....7,,00.html

ChesterGolf · Joined: 17 Aug 2002 Posts: 1624 Location: Nova Scotia

What scope do you recommend for that one? :laugh: How about recoil? Is it manageable? :thumbsup1: :thumbsup1: ::-k

RMulhern · Joined: 08 Dec 2006 Posts: 120 Location: North Louisiana

ChesterGolf wrote: What scope do you recommend for that one? :laugh: How about recoil? Is it manageable? :thumbsup1: :thumbsup1: ::-k

ChesterGolf

Fearful that recoil is only manageable from....AFAR!! Here's what's AWESOME:

"These babies have a maximum range of 40km and a circular error probability (CEP) of 10m. Now that's precision."

Any time ya can shoot at something from 40 "klicks"....and keep it inside a 31' circle......them boys on the other end....ain't got a chance!! :](*,) :](*,)

ChesterGolf · Joined: 17 Aug 2002 Posts: 1624 Location: Nova Scotia

RMulhern wrote: ChesterGolf wrote: What scope do you recommend for that one? :laugh: How about recoil? Is it manageable? :thumbsup1: :thumbsup1: ::-k

ChesterGolf

Fearful that recoil is only manageable from....AFAR!! Here's what's AWESOME:

"These babies have a maximum range of 40km and a circular error probability (CEP) of 10m. Now that's precision."

Any time ya can shoot at something from 40 "klicks"....and keep it inside a 31' circle......them boys on the other end....ain't got a chance!! :](*,) :](*,)

That's a shade over 1 MOA so I'm not sure I can live with that kind of accuracy! ::neener: Seriously though, let's just be glad they are on our side! :thumbsup1: