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Ca_Vermonster's picture
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"State of Fear"

I bought a book to read on the airplane last week called "State of Fear", by Michael Crichton (Jurassic park, Timeline). I am at a part right now where a professor is talking about how we are a nation of fear, in that the politicians and leaders always are telling us to be afraid of something. It was the Cold War, then that stopped. Then it became Global Warming, and that is starting to be proven to be a myth, or at least severely over stated. Also, we now have a Terrorism aspect. In our society, we never have a time of "no fear". It's what keeps the money rolling in to the politicians pockets. We can't seem to just "exist" and be complacent.

After reading all these threads between you guys, with the liberal vs. conservative arguments, I can understand how accurate this may be....

Great book if anyone gets the chance. Going to read a little more after I am done typing this.... cool

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"State of Fear"

Myth? Overstated?

Liberal or conservative I think you'd have to decide science isn't a good way to look at things to think global warming isn't real. Well some still believe in a flat earth also.

Maybe expat can tell you about the permafrost or when the ice leaves Barrow.

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Location: Eatonville, Wa
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"State of Fear"

Civecat- I refer you to one of ex's prior posts, Is it true that global warming causes glaciers to melt and at the same time multiply in size, I think there may be some truth to the theory but, there is little proof other than bandwagon jumping. As a society we feel we always need to have something to fear to be happy.

expatriate's picture
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"State of Fear"

Global warming isn't science -- it's a religion. It has all the ingredients of a religion, to include original sin, its own prophets, indulgences for sale, and heretics that need to be punished.

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"State of Fear"

The study of global climate is firmly science. The interpretation of a warming trend has unfortunately become highly political. I suppose this is because it has heavy consequences for societies energy consumption and costs.

Take another global climate change like ozone depletion. Good science, good policy for correction, not much politicizing. The reason being that the solution was straight forward, just phase out CFC's. Low cost, high gain.

With global warming the costs to reduce green house gases are high especially for developed nations.

expatriate's picture
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"State of Fear"

The earth has warmed and cooled throughout its history. The scientific world is also far from unified on the matter. As a counterpoint, there is solid science correltating warming and cooling to cycles of solar activity. Opponents of man-made global warming theories aren't just crackpots, and I find it disturbing how anyone questioning the concept is immediately attacked and branded a heretic.

In fact, there's some evidence suggesting that we're starting to tip toward a cooling cycle. We're seeing this here in interior Alaska. We had a very late spring, which made for some pretty poor spring black bear hunting. Our average temperature for June was three degrees below normal. July was four degrees below normal. When I got here three years ago, temps were hitting the 90s and half the state was on fire. This year we've only hit 80 a couple days and nothing's burning. In fact, we're currently having the worst flooding since 1967. Our leaves started turning colors two weeks ago, which is almost a month early.

But what do I see when I open the paper? Stories about how global warming is melting all the sea ice, melting permafrost, and driving Alaska toward ecologic disaster. Polar bears have been put on the endangered list, despite the fact that they're thriving at near record numbers and have handled periods of warmth before in history. They're probably the first species to make the list because some people think they MIGHT be at risk in 45 years.

One point I'll definitlely agree on is that Michael Chrichton hit the nail on the head when he said that science has become overly politicized and is no longer science.

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Location: Eatonville, Wa
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"State of Fear"

What I want to know is why I always hear about the north pole's ice melting but never hear that the south pole is growing. kind of an odd coincidence

Ca_Vermonster's picture
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"State of Fear"
civetcat wrote:
Myth? Overstated?

Liberal or conservative I think you'd have to decide science isn't a good way to look at things to think global warming isn't real. Well some still believe in a flat earth also.

Maybe expat can tell you about the permafrost or when the ice leaves Barrow.

Get the book, read it, if only for entertainment....

But, he quotes study after study, statistic after statistic, and backs them up with references. He does not form an opinion, just throws stuff out there for discussion. The most telling to me is the fact that 2/3 rds of the major cities in the world have actually dropped a degree or so over the last 100 years. As someone else said, glaciers are melting, but some are actually growing. Antarctica's icepack is actually, and so-on.

It's a good read.

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Location: Eatonville, Wa
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"State of Fear"

I heard today that the university of washington just put out a study saying some interesting things about climate change, They are saying snow packs have actually increased since 1970 and that prior to 1950 they werent measured. Anyways heres the link http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2008094636_climate06m.html

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"State of Fear"

I read the link rsumerall. They aren't disputing global warming, or that it will more than likely shrink snowpack in the NW. They think it might actually increase it localy. Indeed I'm hoping for higher overall averages of moisture where I live. Change doesn't always mean bad change. Some winners some losers.

Increased temperatures can mean more snow. One of the driest places I've ever been was all snow, it never came down just blew sideways.

I think the global warming debate is pretty much over. Sorry. Hard to argue with science.

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"State of Fear"
civetcat wrote:
I think the global warming debate is pretty much over. Sorry. Hard to argue with science.

According to who? Al Gore? He lives in a house that is less green and energy efficient than President Bush's house in Texas.

Might want to look at this old thread. Some of the links may no longer work, but you should be able to find the video online by searching for "global warming hoax" or "global warming swindle" into a search engine.
http://www.biggamehunt.net/node/20613

Don't get me wrong, I believe we should all be doing our part to take care of this planet and trying to live in a more "green" manner, however some things are out of our control. This earth has gone through heating and cooling cycles for eons.

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