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bitmasher's picture
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Position on Immigration

Immigration, legal and illegal has been a pretty big issue over the last few years and heated up a lot more with the presidential race. Currently it is estimated there are 12 million illegal immigrants, how do you think they should be handled?

Currently I think solving the problem has two parts. First allocate more money, people, and resources to truly locking down the border. I agree that a porous border is a serious security issue from terrorism, drugs, to more illegals. It needs to be locked down in the interest of national security.

The second is forcing those that are hear illegally to seek amnesty and become documented. Basically I agree with employer penalties for knowingly employing an illegal and I also agree if they apply for amnesty and are on the path to citizenship they need to pay a fine (on the order of 10k-20k) for border jumping. The amnesty period would last 1-2 years, after which they would automatically be deported when caught.

I don't support bulk deportation largely because I think a majority of those that have come here illegally have integrated and want to become citizens. Those that are here for any other reason will not step forward when amnesty is offered and will eventually be caught and deported.

One thing about illegals is I think when it comes to crime they should be treated like citizens. Nothing chaps my hide more when I hear about illegals being let go from traffic offenses to more serious crimes because they are undocumented.

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Location: Eatonville, Wa
Joined: 08/26/2007
Posts: 610
Position on Immigration

If you vote for hilliary or obama you could look foreward to all illegals recieving better health benifits than you could get, along with subsidy after subsidy, but unfortuantely thats the way things are going. We have spent all this money on a fence to help keep the numbers down but now in washington state you can get a drivers license even if your an illegall . And Ive heard that pretty soon there will be a few mexican trucking companys that will be able to come through the border without being checked and having no milege limitations, which I believe its at 20 miles now. Which will be great so that they can run over the road cheaper than american drivers with potetially less safe equipment, and knowing how a vast majority of the illegals think not knowing english. anyways theres my rant.

CVC
CVC's picture
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Location: Kansas
Joined: 03/04/2006
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Position on Immigration

I am 100 percent against amensty. You do not reward illegal behavior.

True we cannot deport 12 million people all at once, but we can deport them one at a time each and every time we catch one of these criminals.

And yes, they are all criminals. At the very least they have broken our immigration laws and most likely are also guilty of fraud and identity theft.

If I commit a crime and I get caught no one is going to grant me amnesty so why should we grant amnesty to people who are not citizens?

No driver licenses for illegals
No health care for illegals
No tuition for illegals or their children
No amnesty for illegals

Crime should not pay and we should punish criminals.

cowgal's picture
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Position on Immigration
CVC wrote:

No driver licenses for illegals
No health care for illegals
No tuition for illegals or their children
No amnesty for illegals

Illegal aliens already receive all of the above and more. It really is not practical for all illegal aliens will be deported. We can all say we want that, but who is going to carry it out?

Regardless of how we feel about the whole situation, a firm policy needs to be put into place and then it needs to be enforced diligently. Our borders need to be secured to stem the flow across our borders, right now!

The federal government threw in the towel years ago when they wouldn't help local law enforcement deport the illegals they picked up. They had no choice but to release them back into our cities and states. The illegals learned very quickly that no one was enforcing the laws. Then all the states, counties, cities, etc., had the burden of educating and supplying free medical treatment. In my county we had to increase the mill tax levy for the schools. Our school systems are over burdened with the requirement of supplying interpreters and extra help for kids that do not speak English.

The foundation of this country is based on immigrants and that will not change. What has to change is the large number entering this country illegally. Forcing people to take the proper legal channels is the right thing to do. So they have to wait a few years, so what. That is how its done legally.

This puts it back on the federal government to get off their butts and do something. Ignoring it, does not make it go away. It only gets worse as each day goes by.

CVC
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Position on Immigration

"Illegal aliens already receive all of the above and more. It really is not practical for all illegal aliens will be deported. We can all say we want that, but who is going to carry it out? "

Yes, I know they already recieve these things, but they shouldn't. And, they will continue to receive them unless people start speaking up and being heard by their elected leaders. Some change is occurring.

"The foundation of this country is based on immigrants and that will not change".

First, legal immigration - not illegal immigration and second I ask so what?

Slavery was a foundation of this country, but that changed. Voting by men only was a foundation and that changed too.

We don't need immigrants anymore. We have enough people in this country. Now a guest worker program is another issue, but we don't need immigrants, especially ones that are undeducated.

I am not willing to just give up. And I am not willing to stop calling these people what they are - criminals who have no respect for our laws and therefore no respect for you and me. They are a drain on our society and our open borders are a security risk.

cowgal's picture
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Position on Immigration

I agree that we have a serious problem and that we all should be speaking up. Anyone that lives in a community that is impacted by illegal aliens knows how frustrating the problem is. I live in one of those communities.

The USA has always allowed a certain number of people to immigrate from all over the world. However, right now the actual percentage of legal immigrants is very low compared to the number that enter illegally. So our attention should be focused on securing our borders.

CVC, I agree with most of your points. I just don't think its going to happen overnight. We all have to do our part and make our wishes heard, and continue putting pressure on Washington to step up to the plate and take care of business. Its the Feds that let us all down to begin with, they have to clean up this mess.

bitmasher's picture
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Position on Immigration

Actually illegal immigrants are still the minority of all immigrants in the nation.

This link gives some outdated numbers (2000):

http://www.cis.org/articles/2001/back101.html

Currently there are about 35 million total immigrants, of which 12 million are estimated to be illegal.

I don't think illegal activity should be rewarded either. That is why I think a fine attached to amnesty is acceptable. If you don't pay and apply your eventually gone... assuming of course that the enforcement part of the plan is actually implemented. Any form of amnesty without enforcement is a bad joke.

BTW, if you don't like that this basically amounts to "paying to immigrate", wealthier foreign nationals have been doing it for bigger sum for awhile now, its called the EB-5 program:

http://journal.peishan.org/?p=1427

Quote:
Got $500,000? The U.S. Government’s EB-5 Program Offers Foreign Investors Green Cards for Job Creation
cowgal's picture
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Position on Immigration

I'll have to find the article about how the numbers have changed in recent years. Meaning, more come into the country illegally now, than legally.

It is very difficult to accurately measure the number of illegal immigrants in the USA. According to the CIS article 1.2 million immigrate (legal and illegal) into the USA each year. It is estimated that since 2000 about 850,000 come in illegally each year.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8G6U2ko8&show_article=1
(the above article is from 2006)

There are several articles that estimate the illegal alien numbers much higher:
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0516/p01s02-ussc.html
Quote from the above article:
"Whatever the total is, the annual number of illegal immigrants has exceeded those coming legally for at least the past 10 years: 700,000 illegally compared with 610,000 legally, according to Pew."
(again this is an older article from 2006. Many believe the problem has gotten worse, not better.)

Here is an update on the CIS report. Note that it also states more come in illegally annually than legally.
http://www.cis.org/articles/2007/back1007.html
Quote from above report:
"More than half of post-2000 arrivals (5.6 million) are estimated to be illegal aliens."

So total illegal aliens may still be in the minority when compared to total numbers of immigrants in the USA, however the number of illegal aliens coming into the USA per year has been rapidly escalating since 2000.

CVC
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Location: Kansas
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Position on Immigration
cowgal wrote:
CVC, I agree with most of your points. I just don't think its going to happen overnight. We all have to do our part and make our wishes heard, and continue putting pressure on Washington to step up to the plate and take care of business. Its the Feds that let us all down to begin with, they have to clean up this mess.

You are right. This problem didn't happen overnight and it is not going to be fixed overnight either.

It has only become a problem now because of the numbers and the drain to communities.

The first thing we need to do is to secure our borders. Not only to stem the tide of illegals, but for security reasons too.

WesternHunter's picture
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Position on Immigration

We're at this topic again eh? Kinda reminds me of the 9mm vs .45 argument. It'll be discussed at great length, become heated, then we'll whind up right where we were at the beginning, with no real answers, only smoldering with resentment.

I guess illegal immigration would not be a real problem if those countries of origin were not so bad to live in. Maybe if those third world arm pits would get their act together and make their counrty a better place to live, we would not have a problem in our country will massive waves of immigrants, legal or illegal. True, this problem didn't happen over night and it will not be cleaned up overnight. We need some ambitious politicians to help with this one.

CVC
CVC's picture
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Location: Kansas
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Position on Immigration
Quote:
We need some ambitious politicians to help with this one.

Well, it looks like the choices will be Obama, Clinton or McCain. One out the three definitely won't do anything and I doubt the other two will either.

To steal a line from Ann Coulter, I think I am leaning towards the most conservative of the three - Go Hillary Brick Wall,)

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