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Ca_Vermonster's picture
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A little tweaking.....

Well, I have been trying to plan a hunt for next fall in Colorado.  I have had a couple of possible offers from guys to join me, but haven't finalized anything. 

However, I also was trying to get my Dad and I on a whitetail hunt for big whitetail in the midwest.  But, looking at financials, I am wondering if I should maybe ask my Dad if he'd rather do a combo hunt in Colorado with me. I have to guage his interest in elk, but here is what I am thinking, and can some of you chime in on what options I could take.

My plan was to hunt 2nd season combo hunt, most likely in 62.  I put in for a point for deer, because I was told I would have an average chance at a deer tag with one point.  Then I would buy the OTC elk tag.  Now, my Dad would have no points for anything.  So he could also get the OTC elk, and I was thinking he could buy an OTC bear tag.  That way we'd be covered on 3 species.  I don't think he's too big on bear though. 

So, just wondering, are there any places in the state where a person with no points can draw a buck deer tag, and still have OTC elk permits where we could both have those tags?  Or, would my plan for 62 still be our best bet and go elk/deer for me, elk/bear for Dad?  Price wise, It would only be about $900 for each of us in tag fees, with one OTC elk, and either a bear or deer tag.  Then add in another $1000 or so total for miscellaneous expenses, and it still totals only about what one of us would spend on a Kansas whitetail hunt or something.

Opinions?

mmc1014's picture
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unit 521

I drew 521 for deer with no points this year and there are usually a lot of deer there. It is an OTC elk unit also. I have a friend that elk hunts there and his party usually fills at least half their elk tags which is not bad. I have hunted there.and 62 and have seen far more elk in 521. I usually get my deer but I am none too picky and just shoot the first one with anything that resembles antlers for my yearly sausage stock. There are TONS of hunters and good atv access but no different than you will find in 62. I don't think it is as good for bear as 62 but I have seem a few there. Anyway--just something else to consider.

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Hey Vermonster, I'll look at

Hey Vermonster, I'll look at the deer draw info in my spreadsheet and get back to you by PM.  It will probably be middle of next week because the boy has a cow tag for 2nd rifle and we'll be leaving early tomorrow.  Off the top of my head, I think you'd be pretty lucky to find a 0 point buck tag in decent area for both elk and deer.

Which species is more important to have a good quality hunt for, elk or deer?  They won't likely be mutually exclusive, but some units will be much better for elk opportunity with an OTC bull tag than others.

And unless you're really wanting a bear, I'm not sure I'd worry about picking up the OTC tag for this either.  I haven't looked at the pricing for these, but you may save a few hundred bucks if you decide not to purchase this tag.

At least you have plenty of time to figure out your hunt options for next year.

exbiologist's picture
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lots of units...

just gotta go over the minimum preference point chart in conjunction with the OTC bull map.  

But, of course it helps to look at the actual draw odds too, because sometimes those minimum point charts will throw you off.

Here's the point chart:

http://wildlife.state.co.us/SiteCollectionDocuments/DOW/Hunting/BigGame/Statistics/2011/DeerMinPP11.pdf

 

Here's the OTC bull map:

http://wildlife.state.co.us/SiteCollectionDocuments/DOW/Education/pdf/HunterEducation/OTCRifleElk.pdf

 

Lots of units that would make the cut.  Other possibilities would be to look for units that you could draw 2nd choice, or that your dad would have a better than average chance of drawing with no points.

Ca_Vermonster's picture
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I know this was posted back

I know this was posted back about 4 or 5 months, but I can't remember how to read it.  Is this (DF062P2R) the Unit 62 2nd Rifle Buck tag?  Or is it a doe tag?  Just wondering, because it shows minimum PP for Res and NR hunters at 0.  So does that mean you can possibly draw with 0 points?  I thought someone told me deer in that zone was 1-2 points.

There are "DM", "DE", and "DF" codes.  Ugh....

 Edit:  I think I got it..... Is my example (Deer)(Female)(Unit 62)(2nd Rifle)?????  What's that P before the R?  So I would want an E or a M for "Either" or "Male", yes?

exbiologist's picture
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yep

You got it.  But P is for Private land only, O is for open, which is what you want, meaning either public or private land.

Ca_Vermonster's picture
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Okay, got it.  So for unit

Okay, got it.  So for unit 62, minimum PP for both Res and non are 1 each in Unit 62.  I can't find 521 though.  Is it lumped in with another unit????

exbiologist's picture
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yep

Lumped with 52 and 411.  2nd season hunt code would be DM052O2R

Ca_Vermonster's picture
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Thanks.  So, he could get

Thanks.  So, he could get that one with zero points?  If so, that could be a place to go where we could both get deer and elk tags, correct?  Looking at harvest statistics that I could find from the past few years, it looks like they have about a 25% success rate on elk (In 521), give or take.  Some of that is accounted for in the cow elk harvest though.  I have to look up the deer success rate.

Do you Colorado guys think that the success rates are skewed a little by guys who pass up smaller bucks or bulls to go for a bigger one, or does that have little impact?  In other words, what would be a percentage of shot opportunity versus actual success.

If my Dad and I were willing to shoot the first legal animal of those species, what would you guys think are our chances be at success, assuming we can shoot straight... :wink:  I obviously know it's hunting, not harvesting, but I am trying to maximize our chances by what we could expect to draw, where to hunt, and what tags to get.  If it were just me, i would just get my deer and elk tag for 62, and go for it.  However, if I am flying my 65 year old father out here for what will likely be our only extended hunting trip in his life (Hopefully not), I'd like to have the best chances to succeed.

Ca_Vermonster's picture
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Thanks guys.  Keep the advice

Thanks guys.  Keep the advice rolling in :wink:  I will look at those links Mark.  CO, let me know what your spreadsheet says. And MM, I will look into 521. I was only steering towards 62 because I have a few offers of inside information in that area.

The bear tag is only a back-up to my Dad, if he couldn't get a deer tag  The ultimate would be for us to each have an elk and deer tag.  And we would not be picky at all about the quality of the animal.  I have shot a mule deer doe, but other than that, neither of us have ever killed an elk or mule deer. 

 

mmc1014's picture
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You really should avoid the

You really should avoid the private land tags.  They are only good on private land and in both 62 and 521 (and most of the mesa units) most of the good private land is leased by outfitters.  That is why they have such low numbers of preference points needed to draw them.  There is some decent private land available to hunt but as an "out-of-stater" the rednecks around here will probably charge you pretty heavily to do so.  I am allowed to call them rednecks since I am one of them!!!!  Not to mention most of the private land around 521 that isnt leased is owned by bunny hugging hippies--they are thick up there.  With the open tags you can hunt on either the private or the public so that is definitely the way to go-- so avoid the "P" codes in the brochure. 

I live between 62 and the south grand mesa units (411, 52, 521) and I am really biased toward hunting on the mesa.  I have had really good luck on deer, elk and bear there.  521 is a huge area with lots of places to hunt and good amounts of animals--as long as you dont mind hiking.  It can sound a bit like a war zone during second season so make sure you clad every square inch of yourself in bright orange--but that is the same statewide in any of the OTC elk units. 

I used to hunt both deer and elk in 62.  I did really well on deer and so-so on elk but I know guys that do well there.  I quit hunting up there two years ago because I didnt draw a deer tag even with 3points (despite what the CDOW PP chart tells you). Before that I was drawing about every other year and would get a deer every year.   If you do hunt there come in shape because it can get really steep and really brushy--especially where the elk hang out once the lead starts flying.  Let me know if you draw there and I will get you the GPS coordinates of my super secret deer herd and can point you in the general direction of some elk.  The bears are pretty thick up there too but during second season if we get a cold snap they start to disappear off to their little winter slumber. 

Anyway--let me know if you need anything else on either unit. 

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