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Location: mechanicsburg, pa
Joined: 05/03/2006
Posts: 5
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

ok....seems like there are almost as many opinions on gun cleaning as there are colors in an M&M bag....I would like to dispel some basic issues with good input from you guys.....

two questions.....one related to proper brush and swab use and the other related to copper fouling and proper chemical usage...

1. proper use of the brush and swab.....and I always use a bore guide, so that is a given....with the brush, always keep it wet with CLP when I use it, BUT big question is, " do you push the brush completely through the crown, and take the brush off to return the rod through the guide, or do you just pull the brush back up through to the guide?".....when is the proper time to use a swab??....after patching and brushing??....swab always clean?...or is it soaked in something?

2. with copper fouling chemical treatment such as Shooters Choice "Copper Remover", is there a best use chemical to use that cleanly neutrelizes the ammonia to prevent etching?.....I have heard some folks comment that you shouldn't use Shooters Choice MC#7 to neutrelize....obviously, the last thing I want to do is think I am doing the gun some good by removing copper fouling and following proper protocol with chemicals just to actually do more harm....

reason for this is that I have just started to use Shooters Choice (both chemicals, one as the remover and the other as the neutrelizer) and will send about 4 or 5 patches of the Copper Remover down, takes about 5 or so minutes to do this and then immediately put about 5 patches of the MC#7 down to get rid of any ammonia....then follow up with Hoppes #9 and maybe some CLP before drypatching....

Maybe you guys can set me straight on proper use of brush, swab and copper remover stuff.....would appreciate the help....thanks

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Joined: 12/03/2005
Posts: 1691
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

Probably not right but this has been my procedure for decades.
I clean my rifle with Hopps, if I have it, if not WD40. I run my brush from breach to muzzle. Always that direction. Remove brush,pullrod back,replace brush, repeat.
If I think I may have gotten a little moisture at some time I just run a patch through with a dab of WD40.
The bore in my 270 looks like new and I have fired thousands of rounds out of it since I got it about 1978
I guess the 270 is going to live longer than me

Don Fischer's picture
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Location: Antelope, Ore
Joined: 03/24/2005
Posts: 3190
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

I don't generally brush a lot. Just run a wet Hoppe's patch thru a couple time's than dry it out. Then a wet patch and let it set a bit. Couple dry patches and color blue or green means soak a bit more.

I've gone the squeaky claen route and find no advantage in it. Fire one round and your dirty again. I do like to clean after every 10 shot's or so. This cleaning business does seem to bwe a bunch of voodoo majic! I've a Moelr 600 Rem in 308 I got new a long long time ago. It shoot's 1" groups all day and has never seen a bruhh or a solvent other than Hoppe's. Hoppe's, I like the smell!

bitmasher's picture
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Location: Colorado
Joined: 02/27/2002
Posts: 2973
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

I tend to do the same as Don. Brushes can be useful when shooting lead or if you have a barrel that is pretty fouled up with lead...

I think on average that more folks damage their guns by overcleaning than undercleaning.

WesternHunter's picture
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Joined: 05/05/2006
Posts: 2368
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

Here's the procedure I use. May not work for everyone, but take it for what it's worth. If ya like it, use it, if not....well never mind then. This procedure is for a bolt action rifle. Remove the bolt and clean from the breech end, never the muzzle.

As you all know, make sure your weapon is unloaded and made safe before doing anything. Keep all ammo, food, beverages, tobacco, etc out-of-sight during the cleaning process. Place the gun in a vise for long guns with muzzle slightly tilted down. I like to place a bucket or sturdy box on the floor under the muzzle to catch crud & drip

BASIC CLEANING of the bore for removal of carbon and powder residue:
1. run a solvent saturated snug fitted flannel patch with a slotted jag back and forth through the bore about 3 or 4 times (just a few stokes). Leave the bore wet for about three to five minutes
2. wet a bronze brush of correct caliber with solvent and run that all the way through the bore back and forth (generally once back and forth for each round fired). Wet the brush occasionally during this.
3. Follow this with several solvent wetted flannel patches (same as in step 1.) until one comes out clean (it may take quite a few patches for this to happen). Make sure they are reasonably snug fitted in the bore.
4. some like to follow up with a piston type jag and patches. In any case run two dry patches through the bore and you're done.
5. Inspect the bore with a light or light gathering prizm. If you're satisfied with how clean it is, you are done with the bore. If not the repeat the above steps.

COPPER REMOVAL after basic cleaning:
I like and use Barnes CR-10. Follow the directions on the bottle. I won't repeat them here, but I use similar steps to the above procedure.
Make sure to only use nylon brushes, flannel patches and steel, plastic, or aluminum rods and jags. DO NOT USE any thing made of brass or bronze or copper for this procedure only. Just remember that corroded copper appears greenish blue on patches. Follow up with plenty of gun oil then dry the bore.

I always clean rifles, shotguns and pistols after each firing session or at the end of the trip too.

Never go more than 40 rounds in a rifle without removing the copper fouling. Some say to do it only when accuracy deteriorates. I say (from my own experience) keep it in check early to avoid spending a week or much more removing copper fouling later.

In a pistol barrel, copper fouling isn't all that much of an issue. From my own experience I've found it to be less of a problem. Just to keep it in check I'll remove it about after every 2000 to 3000 rounds or so. Even then, it's never been difficult to remove out of a pistol bore.

I've spoke of bore cleaning here only. Remember that there are other critical parts of a firearm, depending on the type that need attention too. NEVER neglect these parts either. Incorporate these parts into your basic cleaning process. For these parts I like RemOil for both cleaning and lubricating. Fore basic cleaning and powder residue I've found an excellent bore solvent to be "MPro7", but I only use it in the bore and on nothing else. It's also a very powerful de-greaser, will leave steel bone dry. Hence follow up with gun oil.

Hope this helps.

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Location: Misouri
Joined: 11/30/2005
Posts: 365
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

Many many tec in to this. Speaking from a Police sniper I can tell you what I do. After countless tecs used over the years I founds a very simple way that easy and fast.

1.) Rubbing alcohol (yes alcohol). Dip brush in alcohol and run thru back and forth about 20 times.
2.) Dry patch
3.) Wet a patch with alcohol and wrap around an old brush of the same caliber run thru back and forth about 20 times.
4.) Repeat #3
5.) Wrap a dry patch around the brush and run thru several times.
6.) Repeat #5
7.) When patch comes out dry and clean YOUR DONE!

I use no chemical copper removers @ all (I have and don't like them, they take to long and the smell makes you see Elvis).

For copper fouling I only use JB bore paste and only when I see accuracy degrading. I can generlly run about 200-250 rounds of FGMM thru it with no accuracy issues. Follow directions on bottle.

I belive that people kill more barrels by over cleaning them than acutally shooting them. Or just the exact opposite and Never clean them. For all general hunting and/or paper punching thats all you need. If your benchrest shooting your to obsesive compulsive to be on this sight in the first place (kidding). neener!

Best of luck to all.

My cleaning tec has been used on several precision rifles that peoples lives depend on. It's fast, cheap and effective. Not saying its the best but it works for me.

Don Fischer's picture
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Location: Antelope, Ore
Joined: 03/24/2005
Posts: 3190
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

About copper fouling. I went to Shilen's site several years ago, and they will agree with you about copper. They said that you can either show people a clean barrel or small group's!!!

But about Hoppe's #9, I love the smell and hope someone make an after shave like it some day. I'm certain the girl's would love it and if they didn't, what would you want them for????????????

WesternHunter's picture
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Joined: 05/05/2006
Posts: 2368
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

Rubbing alcohol eh? Doesn't sound like a bad idea. Never tried it though. Sounds economical, and have seen rubbing alcohol used as a solvent type cleaner for ink and marker. Works well on adhiesives too. Now do you use the 78% or the 99%?

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Location: Misouri
Joined: 11/30/2005
Posts: 365
help from you guys - removing the VOODOO in cleaning??

I never heard of it untl I went to a sniper school down south. Thought they were messing with me at break when we were cleaning. I tried it and really liked it a bunch. I've used 78 and 99% and both work well.

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