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Joined: 09/23/2004
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Location: Montana
Joined: 02/13/2005
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i like prarie ghost but i prefer the river ghost,works great here in montana.

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Location: NE Minnesota
Joined: 01/14/2004
Posts: 144
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You make a good point shatodavis. I personally never got caught up in the "newest, fastest, quietest, scentless, etc." craze. I have 2 "old-time" rifles, 270 and 06, an 870, a 22 rifle and a "fun gun" CZ 52 pistol. I don't have scent-lok clothes-I'm all about wool. And I don't really care if the deer I shoot has huge horns, though if I see one I'm sure as hell gonna shoot it!

I will teach my children that you don't need the latest gadget to kill a deer or land a fish. It only happens with a little work, a little luck and a LOTTA fun!

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Location: Antelope, Ore
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I think your right shatodavis. The part about improved gear is alright but it's the method and ethics that bother me. I read all the time about the guy's that go looking for the super long shot, 500 yds and up to 1200 yds. I'm not talking about the guy that streaches the limits now and again, knowing he shouldn't.

In the last book Jack O'Conner wrote that part of this crazyness of the sheep grand slam he feared could be laid at his door. He talked about the days when the good hunt's were for a week or so to find true trophy heads and now they jump in a plane and the hunt is over in a couple days.

You got to wonder how many young people today know what the Whelan shelter is, how to make a leanto with saplings or the knots to bind then together. It seems to be to much about "hurry up and shoot something." Does anyone even build a fire pit anymore or understand why its not made with river rocks?

The last time I went deer hunting here, I was down on the John Day River and came across a young man, mid 20's, that had a spike he'd shot. Once in the gut's once in the butt then a finishing shot up close. He was having a devil of a time field dressing it. I asked if he'd ever shot a deer befor and he said he had, in fact several. So I asked why he couldn't field dress one. He'd never had to, someone else always did it for him and nobody showed him how. I stoped what I was doing and gave him some lesson's. No blood on my hands tho!

And it seem's that more and more people rely or super mags to make up for their lack of ability. Not to say there's no place for them, but for the sake of marketing, their value has been greatly over played. Then there's the people that believe that some 30 super mag makes them a 500 yd shooter. It is sad and sicking to see and hear of the people that take taking the life of an animal for granted. So much experimenting on paper rather than flesh. I think most know where I stand on wolves, but if I'm to shoot any, ANY, animal, I want it to be as quick and painless as possible. I absolutely believe in death with dignity, even for the lowest creature's.

It seem's that for to many, these values have gone by the wayside. I noticed that in our wolf discussion, the people most adament against it were also the same one's posting photo's of the outdoor's and wild animals. And one guy who we'll call stillhunter, Not his real name Big smile , was into discussion rather than name calling and who show's up looking at photo's and asking about it? The person formally known as someone else. (Told ya we get to pick on ya! Big smile ) To get those things requires a willingnes, amoung other things, to spend time in nature. Please don't anyone take that to be ment as a slam at anyone not doing it. There are lot's of good reason's not to, but one on the other side showed up and was amazed that we were showing those photo's.

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Location: Wa.
Joined: 03/31/2004
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I saw a bar soap container and a tooth brush in camo. I believe they were only available in Mossy Oak. No consideration for the hunter of the high desert.
The one I really like is the camo jock strap. You're guess is as good as mine.

It's great stuff for the bow hunter. Two years ago my partner was motionless, at full draw, against a tree. Had a buck ten feet from him, snortin' and hoofin' at the ground. The buck knew something wasn't right but, couldn't figure it out. That buck had no idea that as soon as he gave a broadside shot. It would be his last moments.

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Joined: 09/23/2004
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Don you expressed my sentiments better than I was able too. To me the actual taking of an animal is the smallest part of the enjoyment of a hunt. Spending time in the woods with nothing but your own thoughts is the healthiest thing I can do for my own sanity. Time around the campfire telling jokes and lies is what I remember the most from trips. I can honestly say that a trip can be a total success to me and never fire a round at an animal.

Now don't get me wrong I like to kill trophy animals as much as anyone. But, the difference is that I don't have to kill something to make a hunting expedition a success. I hate hearing people complain about an outing as being horrible because they didn't kill anything. When ever I go on a hunt I think of actually getting to kill something as a bonus.

I also don't like the trend that I'm seeing of judging the success or failure of a trip on the size of horns. I actually heard someone tell a story about a guided hunt that was just wrong. He complained that the guide had told him the elk they where looking at was a 320 class bull. The hunter shot the bull, when they measured the horns they only totaled to 300+/- inches. He was outraged! Said the guide had blatantly lied to him. If he had known it was "only 300" he wouldn't have wasted a bullet. GIVE ME A DAMN BREAK. Where I come from a 300 class bull is a trophy by anyones standards. But, thats not the point. The point is that hunting should not ultimately be about the kill. Hunting is an enjoyment of the outdoors, and friends. I guess thats why I am so opposed to high fences game ranches. Hunting there is totally about the kill and the size of the horns. Not what I'm interested in.

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Location: Northern California
Joined: 02/09/2004
Posts: 21
Glad To Read This

Hey guys, I haven't been around here for a while, and I just wanted to say that it sure is good to read this kind of opinion. I agree 100%.

I sure like all the stuff my dad and uncles taught me about the woods.. it seems like the hunting shows really just focus on pulling the trigger. They don't even talk about basic hunter safety..

Anyway, thanks.

EJ

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It's not hunting but want to tell you a story anyway. One of my best friends from hugh school and I decided to take a guided fishing trip for walleyes on the Columbia River this past Feb. We went to Irrigon, Oregon and spent the night in his camper. We were to meet the guide at 8am the next morning, we did.

It was 18 degrees out and foggy as hell. The guides boat was completely open. We hit the water and never got more than 1/4th mile from the dock. We were on the water until 3 pm and it costs us $300. We got two fish.

We had a great time as we relived school years, fixed the economy, saved the world, re-hashed Vietnam (my buddy did two tour's as a field medic) and told a few stories that seemed to embarass the guide a bit. We'd have had a great time had we sat on the dock and caught a cold. It ain't the bag!! Big smile

Here's a photo @ a bit past 8am of another boat; 18 degrees out.

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Location: NE Minnesota
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Good story Don! The older I get, the more I realize what life is really about. And you hit it right on the head there!

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Location: Wa.
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We had this discussion in another thread last year. It's a good one.
I believe that a hunter should not make a shot at a game animal that is beyond the 6" high and 6" low trajectory of the round and the sighting of the rifle.
This would give most every high powered rifle in the hunting field a range from the muzzle to between 350 to 425 yds, at the maximum.
These figures include all of the so called wizzbangs that are on the market.
Where is the necessity of a laser range finder or a scope with more power than 7x.
What I see is. The innovation of these so called wizzbang cartridges has led some hunters to believe that they can increase the range substantially.
This is an untruth. The truth is you will increase the energy because of the increase in muzzle velocity but, the actual increase in range is very minimal. What actually happens is the bullet reaches the maximum range faster. Gravity still has the same effect.
I agree totally with the assessment that their is little or no education to the new hunter.
Don, it was good that you took some time to show that person the steps in field dressing his game. That puts one more person in the field with a little more knowledge.
I have been rifle hunting for many years and have never found the necessity for camo. For bow hunting, I would say it helps sustantially.
It's all about marketing and making money. I've seen, first hand, the deception in advertising.
As long as there is someone with a little extra money in their pocket for a new toy. There are going to be new toys.
The person who dies with the most toys wins!!!

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Thumbs up fuzzybear!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!