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Location: California
Joined: 09/06/2008
Posts: 1071
Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.
Quote:
From the article,
"Our inability to prevent weapons from being illegally smuggled across the border to arm these criminals causes the deaths of police officers, soldiers and civilians."

I can understand where we need to take part of the blame for the drug problem as without demand there would be no supply, but how many of you want to bet where the blame for the druggies guns is going to be placed? Right square on OUR shoulders. One of their big drug smugglers was captured (coincidentaly coinciding with Hillaries visit) today and had in their possession "Kalishnakov rifles and hand grenades". I'm just not seeing these machine guns and grenades at the gun shows I go to but theyll find a way to say it's our fault.
Here's a link to the rest.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2009/

expatriate's picture
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Location: Arizona
Joined: 10/26/2002
Posts: 3207
Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

This sudden alarmism about Mexico serves the Dems on a number of levels. For one thing, it gives them the excuse to take gun control out of the realm of Constitutional rights and into an unimpeachable arena of national security. What? You oppose it? So you support violent Mexican drug cartels that threaten our nation?

Second, it gives the Dems an excuse to enforce border patrol without burning bridges with Hispanic voters. The Dems sold their souls to labor unions ages ago -- and unions don't like illegal immigrants. But if the Dems crack down on illegal immigrants to placate unions, they lose the Hispanic vote in key areas like Southern California. What solves the problem? Some sort of violent threat that justifies a serious crackdown on border security for reasons of national security. Suddenly, it's no longer about keeping Pedro and his family out -- it's about keeping MS-13 out, and that plays a lot better in the media.

So the sudden national appearance of this problem looks a lot to me like a bogeyman to use as topcover for other agendas.

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Location: California
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Posts: 1071
Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

And it dovetails nicely with their war on the 2nd amendment.

Location: Butte, MT
Joined: 01/02/2006
Posts: 234
Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

From what I recall, Hillary said "partially responsible". Sorry, I'm gonna have to agree with that. However, I that certainly doesn't justify leaping to any broadstroke changes in US laws and policy that some folks have been clamoring for, as drug users and gun smugglers are already breaking existing laws. Doing what we can to help Mexico get this mess under control, however, is in order, IMO.

Location: Butte, MT
Joined: 01/02/2006
Posts: 234
Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

Beyond what I said before, I salute the Mexican Government for standing up to these thugs.

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Location: California
Joined: 09/06/2008
Posts: 1071
Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

I think you misunderstood my post sage. As to the drug problem, we certainly are partly to blame. As to the Machine guns, rocket launchers hand grenades and other implements of destruction winding up in the hands of the druggies many on the left here and in the Mexican government have blamed the Gun show's in the U.S. These mexican crimminals aren't getting their artillery legaly here anymore than our own domestice variety of dirtbag does. Just another flimsy excuse to blame gun owners in the U.S. for all the ills of the world. When was the last time you came across full auto A.K's and rocket launchers at your local gun show available under the table?

expatriate's picture
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Location: Arizona
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Posts: 3207
Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

Hillary smells of hypocrisy -- look what her party's up to in her home state:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/26/nyregion/26rockefeller.html

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Location: California
Joined: 09/06/2008
Posts: 1071
Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

Yes Hillary is what she is. However my views on the issue of drug use in general will probably get me bashed here. You guys will be revoking my secret conservative decoder ring but I believe we ought to legalize it, regulate it and tax it just like we do tobacco and alcohol. As you all know I'm all about personal choice and freedom. Take it out of the hands of the cartels, smugglers and crimminals. Break their financial strangle hold on many of these third world nations like Mexico, Panama and Columbia. Now let the beatings commence.

expatriate's picture
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Location: Arizona
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Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

Wow...just when I thought you were conservative, you turn out to be libertarian. No need to worry about your decoder ring...we gave you a fake one. Wink

The first thing I might examine is to point to Amsterdam and consider what drug legalization has done for the Netherlands. Not a pretty picture.

The second thing is an obvious fallacy -- the idea that the way to eliminate crime is to legalize it and tax it.

You ought to read the Columbia Accident Investigation report sometime. One of the key terms used in it is "normalization of deviance." During early shuttle missions, engineers noted that pieces of foam came off the external tank and struck the orbiter. Initially, they were alarmed by this, but as more missions took place without anything serious happening, they came to accept orbiter damage from dislocated foam as a normal occurrence and they stopped worrying about fixing it. You know the rest of the story.

By legalizing drug use and making it an accepted part of society, we will reduce illicit income to drug cartels -- but at enormous social cost in terms of things associated with widespread, condoned drug use. There's a huge issue involving the law of unintended consequences.

I don't consider drug use a "victimless" crime. I've seen too many lives destroyed by drug use -- and usually the vast majority of the damage done is to friends and family members around the user.

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Location: California
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Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

I agree Expat that there are problems with it, however as far as abuses go we have that with alcohol. Prohibition did not alleviate these problems they compounded them by giving organized crime a monetary power base. We had "cartels" then, like now mowing down innocent people over turf wars, bribing politicians and branching out into other areas of criminal endeavor using monies made from illegal sales of liquor. Sound familiar? The liquor , like narcotics was still there. Prohibition did nothing to stem the tide of alcoholism or drunk driving it simply made people like Al Capone rich. The same parallel can be drawn with drug use. Are laws forbidding it helping? No. They create more problems than they solve in my opinion. I fully realize this is a radical solution to the problem with problems of it's own. Is there room for debate here? Of coarse. This is just one persons opinion which makes it neither correct nor incorrect. As to my being libertarian, on some issues , yes, there is no more a conservative ideal than that of personal choice. I wondered why my ring didn't work though. Laugh

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Joined: 05/05/2006
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Clinton : U.S. shares blame for Mexican drug wars.

It's become very PC, almost trendy to apologies for our country and blame the US for every problem around the world. Liberal minded people just don't realize that no other nation in history has had as posative of contribution to the world as we have. If a country end up in termoil, it's because of it's own government's and people's fault, not ours.

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