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jim boyd's picture
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Chuck Hawks Recoil Table

We all know I am a sissy when it comes to recoil - here is a chart where you can at least get some baseline numbers...

This was cut and paste from the Chuck Hawks website - I do like his writing (some do and some don't) but since this is data maybe we can just enjoy this as semi impartial information.

I note the following:

.308                    180 grain     2610 fps    17.5 recoil energy

30.06                  180 grain     2700 fps    20.3 recoil energy

.300 Win Mag       180 grain     2960 fps    25.9 recoil eneergy

 

If we dismiss the .308 as an "out west" gun, the 300WM is throwing the same bullet 9.6 % faster but the recoil is 27.6 % higher.

This hardly seems linear to me... if I did the math correctly.

If you consider the additional recoil from .308 to 30-06, it is only 16.0 % higher.

So, add a muzzle brake to an -06.... and IF you could get a 25% reduction (from 20.3) you would be back down to a very manageable 15.2 ft lbs of recoil energy.This is less than a .308 throwing a 150 grain bullet at 2800 fps.

Does this sound like a reasonable line of thought and IF THE HUNTER will shoot a good shot, at the vitals and stay at say... under 325 yards - does this sound like a viable elk package?

I am trying desparately to talk myself out of a magnum here - but you guys have already figured this out...

Thanks!

Jim

 

Cartridge (Wb@MV) Rifle Weight Recoil energy Recoil velocity .17 HMR (17 at 2550) 7.5 0.2 n/a .17 Rem. (25 at 4000) 8.5 1.6 3.5 .204 Ruger (33 at 4225) 8.5 2.6 4.4 .218 Bee (45 at 2800) 8.5 1.3 3.1 .22 LR (40 at 1165) 4.0 0.2 n/a .22 WMR (40 at 1910) 6.75 0.4 n/a .22 Hornet (45 at 2800) 7.5 1.3 3.3 .22 PPC (52 at 3300) 8.5 3.0 4.8 .221 Fireball (50 at 3000) 8.5 1.8 3.7 .222 Rem. (50 at 3200) 7.5 3.0 5.1 .223 Rem. (45 at 3500) 8.5 2.6 4.5 .223 Rem. (55 at 3200) 8.0 3.2 5.1 .223 Rem. (62 at 3025) 7.0 3.9 6.0 .22-250 Rem. (55 at 3600) 8.5 4.7 6.0 .22-250 Rem. (60 at 3500) 12.5 3.1 4.0 .220 Swift (50 at 3900) 10.5 3.7 4.8 .220 Swift (55 at 3800) 8.5 5.3 6.4 .223 WSSM (55 at 3850) 7.5 6.4 7.4 6mm PPC (85 at 2800) 7.5 5.3 n/a .243 Win. (75 at 3400) 8.5 7.2 7.4 .243 Win. (95 at 3100) 7.25 11.0 9.9 .243 Win. (100 at 2960) 7.5 8.8 8.7 6mm Rem. (100 at 3100) 8.0 10.0 9.0 .243 WSSM (100 at 3100) 7.5 10.1 9.3 .240 Wby. Mag. (100 at 3406) 8.0 17.9 n/a .25-20 Win. (86 at 1460) 6.5 1.3 3.5 .25-35 Win. (117 at 2230) 6.5 7.0 8.3 .250 Savage (100 at 2900) 7.5 7.8 8.2 .257 Roberts (100 at 3000) 7.5 9.3 8.9 .257 Roberts (120 at 2800) 8.0 10.7 9.3 .25 WSSM (120 at 2990) 7.25 13.8 11.1 .25-06 Rem. (100 at 3230) 8.0 11.0 9.4 .25-06 Rem. (120 at 3000) 8.0 12.5 10.0 .257 Wby. Mag. (100 at 3602) 9.25 15.8 10.5 .257 Wby. Mag. (115 at 3433) 9.25 17.7 11.1 .257 Wby. Mag. (120 at 3300) 9.25 15.1 10.3 6.5mm Grendel (120 at 2600) 7.5 8.9 8.8 6.5x55 Swede (129 at 2700) 8.0 12.5 10.0 6.5x55 Swede (140 at 2650) 9.0 10.6 8.7 .260 Rem. (120 at 2860) 7.5 13.0 10.6 .260 Rem. (140 at 2750) 8.25 11.9 9.7 6.5mm-284 Norma (140 at 2920) 8.0 14.7 10.9 6.5mm Rem. Mag. (120 at 3100) 8.0 13.1 10.3 6.5mm Rem. Mag. (140 at 2900) 8.5 13.9 10.3 6.5x68 S (140 at 2990) 8.5 16.8 11.3 .264 Win. Mag. (140 at 3200) 8.5 19.2 12.1 6.8mm Rem. SPC (115 at 2625) 7.5 8.0 8.3 .270 Win. (130 at 3140) 8.0 16.5 n/a .270 Win. (140 at 3000) 8.0 17.1 11.7 .270 Win. (150 at 2900) 8.0 17.0 11.7 .270 WSM (130 at 3275) 8.0 18.7 12.3 .270 WSM (150 at 3000) 8.0 18.9 12.3 .270 Wby. Mag. (130 at 3375) 9.0 21.0 12.3 .270 Wby. Mag. (150 at 3000) 9.25 17.8 11.1 7-30 Waters (120 at 2700) 7.0 10.0 9.6 7x57 Mauser (139 at 2700) 8.75 11.7 9.3 7x57 Mauser (145 at 2725) 8.5 13.0 9.9 7x57 Mauser (160 at 2600) 8.0 14.3 n/a 7x57 Mauser (175 at 2500) 8.0 15.5 11.2 7mm-08 Rem. (120 at 3000) 7.5 12.1 10.2 7mm-08 Rem. (140 at 2860) 8.0 12.6 10.1 .284 Win (150 at 2860) 7.5 17.4 n/a 7x64 (154 at 2850) 8.0 17.9 n/a .280 Rem. (140 at 3000) 8.0 17.2 11.8 .280 Rem. (150 at 2900) 8.0 17.4 11.8 .280 Rem. (160 at 2800) 8.0 17.0 11.7 7mm Rem. SAUM (160 at 2931) 8.0 21.5 13.2 7mm WSM (140 at 3200) 8.0 20.7 12.9 7mm WSM (160 at 3000) 8.0 21.9 13.3 7mm Rem. Mag. (139 at 3100) 9.0 19.3 11.8 7mm Rem. Mag. (150 at 3100) 8.5 19.2 12.1 7mm Rem. Mag. (160 at 2950) 9.0 20.3 12.0 7mm Rem. Mag. (175 at 2870) 9.0 21.7 12.5 7mm Wby. Mag. (140 at 3300) 9.25 19.5 11.7 7mm Wby. Mag. (160 at 3200) 9.0 25.6 13.5 7mm STW (160 at 3185) 8.5 27.9 14.6 7mm Ultra Mag. (140 at 3425) 8.5 25.3 n/a 7mm Ultra Mag. (160 at 3200) 8.5 29.4 n/a .30 Carbine (110 at 1990) 7.0 3.5 5.7 .30-30 Win. (150 at 2400) 7.5 10.6 9.5 .30-30 Win. (160 at 2400) 7.5 12.7 10.5 .30-30 Win. (170 at 2200) 7.5 11.0 9.7 .30-40 Krag (180 at 2430) 8.0 16.6 n/a .300 Sav. (150 at 2630) 7.5 14.8 n/a .307 Win. (150 at 2600) 7.5 13.7 10.9 .308 Marlin Express (160 at 2660) 8.0 13.4 10.4 .308 Win. (150 at 2800) 7.5 15.8 11.7 .308 Win. (165 at 2700) 7.5 18.1 12.5 .308 Win. (180 at 2610) 8.0 17.5 11.9 .30-06 Spfd. (150 at 2910) 8.0 17.6 11.9 .30-06 Spfd. (165 at 2900) 8.0 20.1 12.7 .30-06 Spfd. (180 at 2700) 8.0 20.3 12.8 .300 Rem. SAUM (180 at 2960) 8.25 23.5 13.6 .300 WSM (150 at 3300) 8.25 22.5 13.3 .300 WSM (180 at 2970) 7.25 27.1 15.5 .300 WSM (180 at 2970) 8.25 23.8 13.6 .300 Win. Mag. (150 at 3320) 8.5 23.5 13.3 .300 Win. Mag. (165 at 3110) 8.0 26.2 14.5 .300 Win. Mag. (180 at 2960) 8.5 25.9 14.0 .300 Wby. Mag. (150 at 3400) 9.25 24.6 13.1 .300 Wby. Mag. (180 at 3240) 9.0 31.6 15.0 .300 Ultra Mag. (180 at 3230) 8.5 32.8 15.8 .30-378 Wby. Mag. (180 at 3300) 9.75 42.6 16.8 7.62x39 Soviet (125 at 2350) 7.0 6.9 8.0 7.62x54R Russian (150 at 2800) 9.0 13.1 9.7 7.62x54R Russian (174 at 2600) 9.0 15.0 10.4 7.65x53 Mauser (180 at 2500) 8.0 15.4 n/a .303 British (150 at 2700) 7.5 14.2 11.0 .303 British (180 at 2420) 8.0 15.4 11.1 7.7x58 Jap (150 at 2700) 9.0 11.9 9.2 .32-20 Win. (100 at 1984) 6.5 3.3 n/a .32 Spec. (170 at 2250) 7.0 12.2 10.6 8x57JS Mauser (150 at 2900) 8.0 17.1 11.7 8x57 Mauser (170 at 2400) 8.0 13.6 10.4 8x57JS Mauser (195 at 2500) 8.0 18.5 12.2 .325 WSM (180 at 3060) 7.5 33.1 16.9 .325 WSM (220 at 2840) 7.5 37.5 17.9 8x68S (150 at 3300) 8.5 25.3 13.9 8x68S (200 at 2950) 9.0 29.1 14.4 8mm Rem. Mag. (200 at 2900) 8.5 32.9 15.8 .338-57 O'Connor (200 at 2400) 8.0 19.2 12.4 .338 Marlin Express (200 at 2400) 8.0 16.2 11.4 .338 Marlin Express (200 at 2600) 8.0 22.0 14.0 .338 Federal (200 at 2600) 7.0 22.2 14.3 .338 Federal (210 at 2630) 8.0 21.9 13.3 .338-06 A-Square (200 at 2800) 8.0 23.9 13.9 .338-06 A-Square (250 at 2500) 8.5 28.2 14.6 .338 Win. Mag. (200 at 2950) 8.5 32.8 15.8 .338 Win. Mag. (225 at 2780) 8.5 35.2 16.3 .338 Win. Mag. (250 at 2700) 9.0 33.1 15.4 .338 Ultra Mag (250 at 2860) 8.5 43.1 n/a .338 Lapua Mag. (225 at 3000) 9.5 37.2 15.9 .338-378 Wby. Mag. (250 at 3040) 11.75 41.1 15.0 .340 Wby. Mag. (200 at 3100) 10.0 29.6 13.8 .340 Wby. Mag. (250 at 2941) 9.0 43.4 17.6 .348 Win. (200 at 2510) 8.0 23.7 n/a .357 Mag. (158 at 1650) 7.0 4.7 6.6 .35 Rem. (200 at 2050) 7.5 13.5 10.8 .356 Win. (200 at 2400) 7.5 17.5 n/a .358 Win. (200 at 2490) 8.0 20.9 13.0 .358 Win. (250 at 2260) 7.66 23.0 13.9 .35 Whelen (200 at 2675) 8.0 22.6 13.5 .35 Whelen (225 at 2525) 8.0 25.0 14.2 .35 Whelen (250 at 2400) 7.5 27.9 15.5 .350 Rem. Mag. (200 at 2700) 8.5 22.3 13.0 .350 Rem. Mag. (225 at 2550) 8.5 24.2 13.5 .350 Rem. Mag. (250 at 2500) 8.5 29.0 14.8 9.3x62 (270 at 2550) 8.5 33.3 n/a 9.3x62 (286 at 2360) 9.0 28.0 14.1 9.3x74R (286 at 2400) 8.25 34.3 16.6 .370 Sako Mag. (286 at 2550) 8.5 35.2 16.3 .375 Win. (220 at 2200) 7.5 17.1 12.1 .375 Ruger (270 at 2840) 9.0 41.3 17.2 .375 H&H Mag. (235 at 2700) 9.0 29.5 14.5 .375 H&H Mag. (270 at 2690) 9.0 36.1 16.1 .375 H&H Mag. (300 at 2530) 9.0 37.3 16.3 .375 Ultra Mag (300 at 2800) 8.75 53.2 n/a .376 Steyr (270 at 2580) 8.0 39.0 n/a .378 Wby. Mag. (300 at 2900) 10.25 71.1 n/a .38-40 Win. (180 at 1100) 7.5 3.1 5.2 .38-55 Win. (220 at 1650) 7.5 10.1 9.3 .38-55 Win. (255 at 1415) 7.0 9.5 n/a .404 Jeffery (400 at 2170) 10.25 41.0 16.1 .405 Win. (300 at 2200) 8.0 30.6 15.7 .416 Rem. Mag. (400 at 2400) 10.0 52.9 18.5 .416 Rigby (400 at 2400) 10.0 58.1 19.3 .416 Wby. Mag. (400 at 2700) 10.25 83.0 22.8 .44-40 Win. (200 at 1200) 7.0 3.4 n/a .44 Rem. Mag. (240 at 1760) 7.5 11.2 9.8 .44 Rem. Mag. (275 at 1580) 7.5 11.4 9.9 .444 Marlin (240 at 2400) 7.5 23.3 14.2 .444 Marlin (265 at 2200) 8.5 22.1 12.9 .45 Colt (255 at 1100) 8.0 4.0 5.6 .45 Colt +P (250 at 1500) 6.5 11.1 10.5 .45-70 (300 at 1800) 7.0 23.9 14.8 .45-70 (350 at 1900) 7.0 37.9 18.7 .45-70 (405 at 1330) 7.5 18.7 12.7 .450 Marlin (350 at 2000) 7.0 37.2 18.5 .450 Marlin (350 at 2100) 8.5 33.6 16.0 .458 Win. Mag. (400 at 2050) 9.0 41.7 17.3 .458 Win. Mag. (500 at 2100) 9.0 62.3 21.1 .458 Lott (500 at 2300) 10.0 70.4 21.3 .460 Wby. Mag. (500 at 2600) 11.25 99.6 n/a .470 N.E. (500 at 2150) 11.0 69.3 20.1 .480 Ruger (325 at 1450) 6.25 16.4 13.0 .500 N.E. (570 at 2150) 12.0 74.5 n/a .50 BMG (647 at 2710) 30.0 70.0 12.3

Don Fischer's picture
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I don't know where youn live

I don't know where youn live Jim. Perhaps there is someone on here that has some rifles you could try for recoil. Your really consumed with recoil! If your any where near me I can set up up with a 30-06 and a 308 to try out. Also a 6.5x55 which will be similar to the 260 Rem and capabile of killing elk if you do your part. The 308 with proper bullets is more than a match for an elk. Much is made of cartridges for elk in the west, most is BS. Most elk are killed at way less than 300yds and by picking your shot, you don't need a bullet fired at a speed that will penetrate three tree's, two mountains and a concrete block house. You simply need a bullet capabile of reaching the vitals and stopping them. We have all read about the elk that have taken three shots from a wiz bang mag and then ran off 20mi, not true! Those are elk poorly hit with a wiz bang mag. Some are poorly hit because the shooter thought he was good to go to 500yds because some guy told him his 338 mag was good to 500yds. A poor hit is a poor hit. A good hit with a good bullet kills relatively quickly.

You might want to consider dropping down to a 7-08 and learning to use it well. A 7-08 with a goos 150 to 175gr bullet will cleanly kill the biggest elk you'll ever find out to 250+ yds. There is no need to shoot farther than that, there is no need to shoot that far. We all shoot at a range we choose to shoot! I said above that the 260 Rem was capabile if you do your part. That goes for any round you might choose. I don't advocate the use of cartridges smaller than 26cal (6.5) for game like elk but if I had to I could kill one very dead and very fast with a 22 mag. The most important part of killing big game is not cartridge but how well you use what you have.

Tell us where you live and let's see if we can get you some real help.

jim boyd's picture
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Don, You, sir, are a scholar

Don,

You, sir, are a scholar and a gentleman.

I do genuinely hate recoil and have worked for years to limit my exposure to it.

I do have a 7mm-08 and am VERY comfortable with it - even to 250 yards. I almost hate to admit this - but it has a muzzle brake on it!

I routinely shoot at 200 yards at the range and am installing a new 300 yard range at a new lease that I have this year - 2011.

I have taken many deer - but most at less than 100 yards.

In the last several years, I have stretched it out -I have kills at 227 yards, 168 yards and several more between 100 and 150.

I do own and shoot a .308... and it was purchased and designed solely to limit recoil. It is a 10FP Savage in a Boyd's laminated thumb hole stock.. the rig weighs about 12 pounds - maybe even a little more.... and shoots like a dream.

I use a 168 grain bullet (that is what that rifle likes) and it is pure hell on a deer.

In modesty - and I do try to be reasonably modest - I have been very effective at one shot kills with most of the deer DRT, particularly in the last 5 years.

Now, I have the desire (burning) to go out west.

The .308 is clearly too heavy.

I can use the 7mm-08 - but I worry that I would be ridiculed for bringing too light a gun... and what if I wounded and lost an elk (even if I would have lost it with a 375 H&H) - how would I reason it out to myself that I COULD have been better prepared???

Does that make sense?

So... on to the 30-06 and a new project - which I love anyway....

I do genuinely appreciate your kind offer at help - and I need all the help I can get - but I am worlds away in SC.

I love Savage and the on/off muzzle brake seems a no brainer.

I am going to top this rifle off with a smaller scope... probably a 3-9x42 Meopta Meostar and try to keep it as light as possible.

In this manner, I get a new rifle, a new project and a rifle that would be suitable to either coast.

Can I get an amen to that?

thanks!!!

Jim

Don Fischer's picture
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If people want a reason to

If people want a reason to ridicule you they will find one or manufacture one. Get the 30-06 and do what you need to do. Just don't get rid of the 7-08, it is your bread and butter. I could go to S. carolina and find myself a deer to shoot at well beyoud anything reasonable, doesn't sound to me like you do that.

Work up a load for that 7-08, do you reload? I should have asked that first. A good 160gr class bullet, even cup and core, is going to be adequate for elk at reasonable range, to 250yds. Sometimes I think some people look at a dead elk then the cartridge they shot it with and don't really believe it worked. Of course it did. A lot of guys have killed a lot of elk with cartridges like the 308 and 30-06 and for some reason all of a sudden decide that they need something bigger. Then once they get it they are amazed they didn't make the change sooner. The part they don't seem to get is that their magnum didn't really do anything their 308 didn't do! Others get a bigger cartridge because they are just sure they need to be able to shoot 350 to 400 yds yet in their life time they seldom shoot much over 200yds.

If I had to choose between a 7-08 and a 30-06 that I had, I'd choose the one I shot best and was most confident in, take the other along in case something happens to your main gun.

Refreshing to hear from someone who's up front about recoil. I don't like it either!

groovy mike's picture
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Yuck!

jim boyd wrote:

Cartridge (Wb@MV)Rifle WeightRecoil energyRecoil velocity.17 HMR (17 at 2550)7.50.2n/a.17 Rem. (25 at 4000)8.51.63.5.204 Ruger (33 at 4225)8.52.64.4.218 Bee (45 at 2800)8.51.33.1.22 LR (40 at 1165)4.00.2n/a.22 WMR (40 at 1910)6.750.4n/a.22 Hornet (45 at 2800)7.51.33.3.22 PPC (52 at 3300)8.53.04.8.221 Fireball (50 at 3000)8.51.83.7.222 Rem. (50 at 3200)7.53.05.1.223 Rem. (45 at 3500)8.52.64.5.223 Rem. (55 at 3200)8.03.25.1.223 Rem. (62 at 3025)7.03.96.0.22-250 Rem. (55 at 3600)8.54.76.0.22-250 Rem. (60 at 3500)12.53.14.0.220 Swift (50 at 3900)10.53.74.8.220 Swift (55 at 3800)8.55.36.4.223 WSSM (55 at 3850)7.56.47.46mm PPC (85 at 2800)7.55.3n/a.243 Win. (75 at 3400)8.57.27.4.243 Win. (95 at 3100)7.2511.09.9.243 Win. (100 at 2960)7.58.88.76mm Rem. (100 at 3100)8.010.09.0.243 WSSM (100 at 3100)7.510.19.3.240 Wby. Mag. (100 at 3406)8.017.9n/a.25-20 Win. (86 at 1460)6.51.33.5.25-35 Win. (117 at 2230)6.57.08.3.250 Savage (100 at 2900)7.57.88.2.257 Roberts (100 at 3000)7.59.38.9.257 Roberts (120 at 2800)8.010.79.3.25 WSSM (120 at 2990)7.2513.811.1.25-06 Rem. (100 at 3230)8.011.09.4.25-06 Rem. (120 at 3000)8.012.510.0.257 Wby. Mag. (100 at 3602)9.2515.810.5.257 Wby. Mag. (115 at 3433)9.2517.711.1.257 Wby. Mag. (120 at 3300)9.2515.110.36.5mm Grendel (120 at 2600)7.58.98.86.5x55 Swede (129 at 2700)8.012.510.06.5x55 Swede (140 at 2650)9.010.68.7.260 Rem. (120 at 2860)7.513.010.6.260 Rem. (140 at 2750)8.2511.99.76.5mm-284 Norma (140 at 2920)8.014.710.96.5mm Rem. Mag. (120 at 3100)8.013.110.36.5mm Rem. Mag. (140 at 2900)8.513.910.36.5x68 S (140 at 2990)8.516.811.3.264 Win. Mag. (140 at 3200)8.519.212.16.8mm Rem. SPC (115 at 2625)7.58.08.3.270 Win. (130 at 3140)8.016.5n/a.270 Win. (140 at 3000)8.017.111.7.270 Win. (150 at 2900)8.017.011.7.270 WSM (130 at 3275)8.018.712.3.270 WSM (150 at 3000)8.018.912.3.270 Wby. Mag. (130 at 3375)9.021.012.3.270 Wby. Mag. (150 at 3000)9.2517.811.17-30 Waters (120 at 2700)7.010.09.67x57 Mauser (139 at 2700)8.7511.79.37x57 Mauser (145 at 2725)8.513.09.97x57 Mauser (160 at 2600)8.014.3n/a7x57 Mauser (175 at 2500)8.015.511.27mm-08 Rem. (120 at 3000)7.512.110.27mm-08 Rem. (140 at 2860)8.012.610.1.284 Win (150 at 2860)7.517.4n/a7x64 (154 at 2850)8.017.9n/a.280 Rem. (140 at 3000)8.017.211.8.280 Rem. (150 at 2900)8.017.411.8.280 Rem. (160 at 2800)8.017.011.77mm Rem. SAUM (160 at 2931)8.021.513.27mm WSM (140 at 3200)8.020.712.97mm WSM (160 at 3000)8.021.913.37mm Rem. Mag. (139 at 3100)9.019.311.87mm Rem. Mag. (150 at 3100)8.519.212.17mm Rem. Mag. (160 at 2950)9.020.312.07mm Rem. Mag. (175 at 2870)9.021.712.57mm Wby. Mag. (140 at 3300)9.2519.511.77mm Wby. Mag. (160 at 3200)9.025.613.57mm STW (160 at 3185)8.527.914.67mm Ultra Mag. (140 at 3425)8.525.3n/a7mm Ultra Mag. (160 at 3200)8.529.4n/a.30 Carbine (110 at 1990)7.03.55.7.30-30 Win. (150 at 2400)7.510.69.5.30-30 Win. (160 at 2400)7.512.710.5.30-30 Win. (170 at 2200)7.511.09.7.30-40 Krag (180 at 2430)8.016.6n/a.300 Sav. (150 at 2630)7.514.8n/a.307 Win. (150 at 2600)7.513.710.9.308 Marlin Express (160 at 2660)8.013.410.4.308 Win. (150 at 2800)7.515.811.7.308 Win. (165 at 2700)7.518.112.5.308 Win. (180 at 2610)8.017.511.9.30-06 Spfd. (150 at 2910)8.017.611.9.30-06 Spfd. (165 at 2900)8.020.112.7.30-06 Spfd. (180 at 2700)8.020.312.8.300 Rem. SAUM (180 at 2960)8.2523.513.6.300 WSM (150 at 3300)8.2522.513.3.300 WSM (180 at 2970)7.2527.115.5.300 WSM (180 at 2970)8.2523.813.6.300 Win. Mag. (150 at 3320)8.523.513.3.300 Win. Mag. (165 at 3110)8.026.214.5.300 Win. Mag. (180 at 2960)8.525.914.0.300 Wby. Mag. (150 at 3400)9.2524.613.1.300 Wby. Mag. (180 at 3240)9.031.615.0.300 Ultra Mag. (180 at 3230)8.532.815.8.30-378 Wby. Mag. (180 at 3300)9.7542.616.87.62x39 Soviet (125 at 2350)7.06.98.07.62x54R Russian (150 at 2800)9.013.19.77.62x54R Russian (174 at 2600)9.015.010.47.65x53 Mauser (180 at 2500)8.015.4n/a.303 British (150 at 2700)7.514.211.0.303 British (180 at 2420)8.015.411.17.7x58 Jap (150 at 2700)9.011.99.2.32-20 Win. (100 at 1984)6.53.3n/a.32 Spec. (170 at 2250)7.012.210.68x57JS Mauser (150 at 2900)8.017.111.78x57 Mauser (170 at 2400)8.013.610.48x57JS Mauser (195 at 2500)8.018.512.2.325 WSM (180 at 3060)7.533.116.9.325 WSM (220 at 2840)7.537.517.98x68S (150 at 3300)8.525.313.98x68S (200 at 2950)9.029.114.48mm Rem. Mag. (200 at 2900)8.532.915.8.338-57 O'Connor (200 at 2400)8.019.212.4.338 Marlin Express (200 at 2400)8.016.211.4.338 Marlin Express (200 at 2600)8.022.014.0.338 Federal (200 at 2600)7.022.214.3.338 Federal (210 at 2630)8.021.913.3.338-06 A-Square (200 at 2800)8.023.913.9.338-06 A-Square (250 at 2500)8.528.214.6.338 Win. Mag. (200 at 2950)8.532.815.8.338 Win. Mag. (225 at 2780)8.535.216.3.338 Win. Mag. (250 at 2700)9.033.115.4.338 Ultra Mag (250 at 2860)8.543.1n/a.338 Lapua Mag. (225 at 3000)9.537.215.9.338-378 Wby. Mag. (250 at 3040)11.7541.115.0.340 Wby. Mag. (200 at 3100)10.029.613.8.340 Wby. Mag. (250 at 2941)9.043.417.6.348 Win. (200 at 2510)8.023.7n/a.357 Mag. (158 at 1650)7.04.76.6.35 Rem. (200 at 2050)7.513.510.8.356 Win. (200 at 2400)7.517.5n/a.358 Win. (200 at 2490)8.020.913.0.358 Win. (250 at 2260)7.6623.013.9.35 Whelen (200 at 2675)8.022.613.5.35 Whelen (225 at 2525)8.025.014.2.35 Whelen (250 at 2400)7.527.915.5.350 Rem. Mag. (200 at 2700)8.522.313.0.350 Rem. Mag. (225 at 2550)8.524.213.5.350 Rem. Mag. (250 at 2500)8.529.014.89.3x62 (270 at 2550)8.533.3n/a9.3x62 (286 at 2360)9.028.014.19.3x74R (286 at 2400)8.2534.316.6.370 Sako Mag. (286 at 2550)8.535.216.3.375 Win. (220 at 2200)7.517.112.1.375 Ruger (270 at 2840)9.041.317.2.375 H&H Mag. (235 at 2700)9.029.514.5.375 H&H Mag. (270 at 2690)9.036.116.1.375 H&H Mag. (300 at 2530)9.037.316.3.375 Ultra Mag (300 at 2800)8.7553.2n/a.376 Steyr (270 at 2580)8.039.0n/a.378 Wby. Mag. (300 at 2900)10.2571.1n/a.38-40 Win. (180 at 1100)7.53.15.2.38-55 Win. (220 at 1650)7.510.19.3.38-55 Win. (255 at 1415)7.09.5n/a.404 Jeffery (400 at 2170)10.2541.016.1.405 Win. (300 at 2200)8.030.615.7.416 Rem. Mag. (400 at 2400)10.052.918.5.416 Rigby (400 at 2400)10.058.119.3.416 Wby. Mag. (400 at 2700)10.2583.022.8.44-40 Win. (200 at 1200)7.03.4n/a.44 Rem. Mag. (240 at 1760)7.511.29.8.44 Rem. Mag. (275 at 1580)7.511.49.9.444 Marlin (240 at 2400)7.523.314.2.444 Marlin (265 at 2200)8.522.112.9.45 Colt (255 at 1100)8.04.05.6.45 Colt +P (250 at 1500)6.511.110.5.45-70 (300 at 1800)7.023.914.8.45-70 (350 at 1900)7.037.918.7.45-70 (405 at 1330)7.518.712.7.450 Marlin (350 at 2000)7.037.218.5.450 Marlin (350 at 2100)8.533.616.0.458 Win. Mag. (400 at 2050) 9.041.717.3.458 Win. Mag. (500 at 2100)  9.062.321.1.458 Lott (500 at 2300)  10.070.421.3.460 Wby. Mag. (500 at 2600) 11.2599.6n/a.470 N.E. (500 at 2150) 11.069.320.1.480 Ruger (325 at 1450) 6.2516.413.0.500 N.E. (570 at 2150) 12.074.5n/a.50 BMG (647 at 2710) 30.070.012.3

 

I couldn't read the chart that you cut and pasted at all - it all mushed toghether but when I quoted it to post I can read it perfectly in the quotations.  Lets see what happens after I get through preview.  Maybe it wil help.

 

NOPE!  That's weird it won't post as a chart at all.

jaybe's picture
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Grand Slam Challenge Winner!
Location: S.E. Michigan
Joined: 10/19/2010
Posts: 817
Great Question!

Jim -

 I am so glad that you asked this question. It not only brought a reply from a person who is knowledgable about what it takes to kill an elk, but it addressed an issue that many people have - whether or not they realize it or are willing to admit it.

I don't think anyone in their right mind likes recoil (unless they have been impaired by too much recoil). lol

I have long believed that much of the "magnum craze" has been fueled by gun and ammo makers who (naturally) want to both expand the choices that shooters have and also increase profit. This is not stated to be a negative - they are in the business to make money - but what they do in this respect isn't necessarily designed to have the shooter's best interest in mind.

As the Moderator so eloquently stated, "Most elk are killed at way less than 300yds and by picking your shot, you don't need a bullet fired at a speed that will penetrate three tree's, two mountains and a concrete block house. You simply need a bullet capabile of reaching the vitals and stopping them." Oh, that is so good - I wish everyone who has bought into the magnum craze could read that!

Stick with what works, Jim. You'll enjoy your trip much more, and the elk you bring back home will be killed with one well-placed bullet from a rifle fired by a confident hunter.

 

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