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outdoorsman121's picture
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Bear Baiting

I live in upstate NY. We have plenty of bears but are hard to hunt. It is illegal to bait bears in NY State. This makes bear hunting a very hard and challenging experience. Although I believe that in some case baiting should not be allowed, if you place a bear bait in an area in upstate NY you are not guaranteed to have a bear come into that sight. It simply increases your chances. I believe baiting of bears should be legalized in NY. Any other opinions on this topic? :yes:

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I am not a big fan of it, as

I am not a big fan of it, as it's hard to imagine shooting something that is feasting on day old bagels and doughnuts.  However, I can understand why some people need to do it in some places.  Places where the woods are really thick and vast, they need to do something to draw them out.  Spot and stalk hunting would not be very successful.  Knowing what I do about the terrain in Upstate New York, I am not sure how baiting would work.  I too do not think there would be a guarantee to draw them to the bait.  Places where the bear population is high is where it would work best.

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I support hunting over bait

I support hunting over bait where it is legal, but with that said, I would, if I had a vote, vote not to allow hunting over bait.  I suppose I could be swayed if it was shown that baiting was absolutely necessary to increase harvest numbers to stem overpopulation.

My only concern about baiting is that it may have unintended consequences, like spreading CWD in deer herds.

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Well, I think the fortunate

Well, I think the fortunate thing is that bears are not as social as deer are.  You could bait deer, and see 20 deer come in and eat all around each other.  With bear baiting, you can see multiple bears, but unless it's a momma and her cubs, you will usually see them hang out around the edges and wait until the bigger one is done eating.  Or, if it's a smaller one, they somethimes will try to drive them off.

CWD is usually spread through direct contact, like nose to nose, as best as they can tell.  All those captive elk, where they believe it first originated, or at least started it's big spread, when they were eating from food troughs banging into each other.  Totally different situation.

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Well, I think the fortunate

Well, I think the fortunate thing is that bears are not as social as deer are.  You could bait deer, and see 20 deer come in and eat all around each other.  With bear baiting, you can see multiple bears, but unless it's a momma and her cubs, you will usually see them hang out around the edges and wait until the bigger one is done eating.  Or, if it's a smaller one, they somethimes will try to drive them off.

CWD is usually spread through direct contact, like nose to nose, as best as they can tell.  All those captive elk, where they believe it first originated, or at least started it's big spread, when they were eating from food troughs banging into each other.  Totally different situation.

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Do you if bear can get CWD or

Do you if bear can get CWD or one of the other TSE's?  This is really, in my opinion, the only reason to have a discussion on whether baiting should be legal.  If it does, as has been suggested, spread CWD then we should abandon the practice.

Domestic herds will still pose a risk and strict contols should be put on them.  I know some elk herds are tested for CWD, but I think it is a voluntary program.  Maybe it should be mandatory with a good inventory of the stock and space requirements for the elk too.

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Ca_vermonster -- Direct

Ca_vermonster -- Direct contact is not the only way that we know Chronic Wasting Disease is spread. Verticle transmission also takes place. Prions have also been shown to be able to persist in the soil for long periods of time. They are unliving entities and therefore are not limited in nearly as many ways how long they can persist outside of hosts. Under this mode of transmission, all it takes is an individual eating the wrong piece of grass or consuming the wrong bit of soil (for mineral contents) and that individual can be exposed to the prions; without ever having contact with an infected animal.

CVC -- Where are you getting information that it is thought that it is possible for a bear to contract Chronic Wasting Disease or any of the other Transmissable Spongeform Encelphalopathies? I would be very interested to check out that source as our current belief (backed up by a lot of years of research) shows that species outside of the family cervidae can not be infected by CWD.

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You wrote, CVC -- Where are

You wrote, CVC -- Where are you getting information that it is thought that it is possible for a bear to contract Chronic Wasting Disease or any of the other Transmissable Spongeform Encelphalopathies? I would be very interested to check out that source as our current belief (backed up by a lot of years of research) shows that species outside of the family cervidae can not be infected by CWD.

I think you misinterpreted my post.  I did leave out a word - typo.  I was asking if bears could get CWD or similar disease.  i don't know.  If humans can get infected by consuming BSE infected cattle, isn't it possible that CWD could be transmissble to animals that consume CWD infected animals?  I don't know so that is why I am asking.

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Hawkeye wrote: "Ca_vermonster

Hawkeye wrote: "Ca_vermonster -- Direct contact is not the only way that we know Chronic Wasting Disease is spread. Verticle transmission also takes place. Prions have also been shown to be able to persist in the soil for long periods of time. They are unliving entities and therefore are not limited in nearly as many ways how long they can persist outside of hosts. Under this mode of transmission, all it takes is an individual eating the wrong piece of grass or consuming the wrong bit of soil (for mineral contents) and that individual can be exposed to the prions; without ever having contact with an infected animal."
Thanks for posting this information, Hawkeye. I was unaware CWD could live outside the host and could be spread to other cervidae in this manner.

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BSE is caused by prions like

BSE is caused by prions like CWD and the situation that Hawkeye described is the problem with eradicating BSE entirely.  The prions can not be destroyed at normal cooking tempertures.  It takes a very high heat to destroy them.  Note, I said destroy and not kill, because like Hawkeye said they are not living to begin with. One of the ways they attempt to prevent the spread in cattle is to ban the feeding of ruminant proteins to ruminants.  They believe that cattle eating feed with infected mammalian tissue can spread the disease so they have banned it.

Regardless of our feelings toward baiting and other activities, I think our actions should be guided by science and not emotion and certainly not "ethics."  Ethics are fluid and vary from individual to individual so I will not impose my ethics on someone if they do not impose theirs on me.

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To speak to the content of

To speak to the content of the original post, whether bear baiting should be legal or not, my belief is not cut and dry. In many parts of the country (and continent because this is definitely true for much of Canada) it is not feasable to get a robust enough of a harvest to control bear populations without baiting. Here in Colorado though, it is more feasable. Although some would argue for baiting in this state by citing the rise in bear/human conflicts without baiting. I am glad that baiting isn't allowed in Colorado, because this is the state that I hunt the most and I know that spot and stalk hunting can prove succesfull here. I would vote against baiting here in this state. But I do not have any problem with other states allowing baiting for the reasons stated earlier.

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