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Location: Missouri/Arkansas
Joined: 08/21/2003
Posts: 891
All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle

Not everyone wants to just go with a 30-06! Or a 270, for that matter. A 300 Winchester Magnum doubles the range at which you can deliver 2000 ft-lbs of energy to a tough animal. It also gives you less bullet drop and drift.

Another example is the 7mm Remington Magnum. It shoots flatter than the 270, and hits harder than the 30-06. It out-performs both rounds in terms of trajectory and killing power. Ironically, the recoil from this round is about the same as from a typical 30-06 rifle.

The ultra-mags and Weatherby rounds give you still more killing power. They don't kill anything the normal mags won't, but they do increase the range at which you can deliver a large amount of energy.

As far as flat-shooting goes, the flatter the trajectory is, the less you have to ''hold over'' with the crosshairs.

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All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle
Captain_Obvious wrote:
Not everyone wants to just go with a 30-06! Or a 270, for that matter. A 300 Winchester Magnum doubles the range at which you can deliver 2000 ft-lbs of energy to a tough animal. It also gives you less bullet drop and drift.

As far as flat-shooting goes, the flatter the trajectory is, the less you have to ''hold over'' with the crosshairs.

Where did you get the figures on delivering 2000 fpe at? A 30-06 w/180 gr bullet will deliver somewhere around 2100 fpe @ 200 yds. The 300 Win mag is something under 1900fpe @ 400yds. That's from the Hornady manual using the same bullet for both. The accepted min for deer is something like 1000fpe. The 30-06 delivers just under 1300fpe to 500 yds!

As for wind drift, according to Hornady, with a bullet of 420BC, the 300 mag will drift 9.5" and the 30-06 will drift 11.1", this with a full cross wind of 10mph. 1.6" at 400yds just isn't that much concidering shooting at an animal with a kill zone of about 10" or more.

As for less hold over, what difference does it make if you hold over 19" required by the 300 mag at 400yds or 25" required by the 30-06 at 400yds w/200 yd zero? You still have to hold over and performence doesn't change one bit. Shooting at a black spot on a target at 400 yds I doubt many could tell you what 6" looks like. Try this. Get three one inch dowel's, 5 1/2", 6" and 6 1/2" and have someone hold them up one at a time from about 30 yds, one at a time and tell me which is which as your showed them. If you can judge 6" at 400 yds thru a scope, this should be a breeze. Once you are beyond max point blank range, trajectory is meaningless and the question was about trajectory.

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Location: Fort Collins, CO, USA
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All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle

Once you get past the aversion to ranging and turning knobs, the flat-ness of a cartridge means very little.

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Location: Missouri/Arkansas
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All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle

Why even ask about the 2000 ft-lb part? You answered your own question. What's 100 ft-lbs? 1900 at 400 yards makes it roughly double the distance you can deliver a ton of energy. I was off by 100 ft-lbs. Big deal!

As for wind drift, my post said the .300 has less drift. Correct me if I am wrong, but 9 inches is less than 11, regardless of how small the difference may be.

As for hold-over, my post says the .300 requires less hold-over. I thank you for making my point. The .300 requires less hold-over.

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Location: Maui, Hawaii
Joined: 05/03/2006
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All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle

This is an amusing thread to read. I apologize if I ruffle any feathers. This is my perspective, it may not be right, but, it is my perspective. Flatter shooting cartridges make better hunters out of mediocre ones. I say this because I believe that the hunter that can close the range to his quarry is a better hunter than the guy who has to take the shot from 250+ yards.

I understand the challenge and skill required to make long shots, but, I prefer to take that challenge on the range and not with a living, breathing animal.

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All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle
haiku_rodney wrote:
This is an amusing thread to read. I apologize if I ruffle any feathers. This is my perspective, it may not be right, but, it is my perspective. Flatter shooting cartridges make better hunters out of mediocre ones. I say this because I believe that the hunter that can close the range to his quarry is a better hunter than the guy who has to take the shot from 250+ yards.

I understand the challenge and skill required to make long shots, but, I prefer to take that challenge on the range and not with a living, breathing animal.

Well that sure don't ruffle my feather's. But I might add the flatter shooting cartridges do not make better shooter's out of mediocre ones!

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Location: Somewhere Up There
Joined: 01/06/2007
Posts: 217
All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle

OK, I'll bite on this one. I think the quality of a hunter is independent of his or her gear. I don't think a mediocre hunter is made better by a big rifle and Don hit it right on the head. The magnums require some skill and practice and those mediocre sorts who think a magnum will make them better hunters are often very disappointed.

I also agree in close stalking and I'm fairly adept at it, but I still shoot a magnum for several reasons. I've been caught out in the open enough by big mule deer and antelope that I like the extra "horsepower" of the 300 WSM - just a bit of insurance in the trajectory, and another bit for penetration and hydrodynamic shock. And although I don't hunt dangerous game, I frequent areas inhabited by grizzlies - another place where a little insurance never hurt. And yes, I shoot it very well.

The one thing I do wonder about is why all the fuss about the fuss over magnums? If somebody wants to buy a new WSM or whatever why does it matter to the next guy? Personally, I'd rather see someone go too big than too small. I've put more wounded antelope down with .224 bullets in them than I can count, yet nobody is making a fuss about the walking wounded that too small of a caliber leaves.

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Location: new brunswick
Joined: 12/07/2006
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All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle

YOU GOT IT ALL RIGHT MAN Thumbs up WSM IS THE ONLY TICKET Thumbs up

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Location: pennsylvania
Joined: 01/27/2007
Posts: 131
All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle
wonksy wrote:
YOU GOT IT ALL RIGHT MAN Thumbs up WSM IS THE ONLY TICKET Thumbs up

I'm still not convinced on the short mags they dont do anything their big brothers cant or havent done already. but if you just got to have one i guess then their fine. Think

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All the fuss of a flatter shooting rifle

Anybody know what a 30-378 can do that a 300 Savage can also do?
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Kill a deer as far away as you can hit it!

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