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CVC
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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt

Cowgal what you said is true, but consider that by purchasing a ticket a contract between the airline and the passenger was entered. They have an obligation to honor that contract and should not arbitrarily and capriously deny a passenger passage.

An even private industry is bound by certain laws. Would you support the airline not allowing to travel on their privately owned airline because of their race? Of course not, so why do you support them denying passage to someone because of thier religous beliefs or national origin when those passengers have been cleared and do not pose a security threat?

Suppose you were denied passage on an international flight for your dream vacation or an important business meeting and were denied passage because your shirt had a slogan on it in English? I'm sure you'd understand and leave the plane without a fight - right?

I saw a guy with the t-shirt stating Freedom isn't free. Some might feel that is offensive - should he be kicked off a plane because a Muslim finds it offensive?

Unless you are willing to accept the same rules for yourself, then you need to defend the rights of others.

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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt

CVC I agree its a very fine line between what is acceptable (and legal) and what's not. That's why attorneys draft all that "fine print." It really is an important part of doing business. Before I fly, I always review each airline's guidelines and rules. Each one is different. If the fine print states that you cannot wear clothing that is offensive, then the airline has the right to enforce it. I may not like the rule, but if want to fly on that airline, I know that I have to abide by that rule. No different than a restaurant having a dress code.

I fly frequently, and have on occasion been pulled aside for additional scrutiny. Sometimes they explain why and other times I'm left to wonder and yes once I nearly missed an important flight and it stressed me out terribly. I accept it, since I feel its necessary to keep our skies safe.

CVC
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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt

Speaking of offensive, I just noticed you, Expatriate and I are labeled as "bull whackers."

Not so sure about that label...... Think Big smile

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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt
CVC wrote:
Speaking of offensive, I just noticed you, Expatriate and I are labeled as "bull whackers."

Ha ha! I'm sure the thinking was that once you had 1000+ posts under your belt, you would be capable of whacking your own bull - as in bull elk! lol

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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt

Expatriate wrote,

Quote:
Whether you like it or not, our society has accepted limits on free speech via culturally accepted norms. An airliner is not a public square, and limits on speech and behavior are much more severe because one unruly passenger (for whatever reason) can threaten everyone by affecting safety of flight.

I don't recall that the individual in question was unruly or affecting airline safety. He was wearing a T shirt with Arabic writing on it. I have stated earlier freedom is a double edged sword and that it is in our best interests to keep both edges sharp. What if passengers on that same flight had found my NRA ball cap to be offensive or the airline had refused to allow me on the plane because I excersise my second amemdment rights? Is the fact I am a shooter and hunter a threat to airline safety or offensive.? It may be to some people. People such as HCI or PETA members. Do they have the right to have me (or you) thrown off the plane? No. The fact is they don't, nor should they. Either the same standard holds true for all or holds true for none. And Cowgal, please let me know which flight your taking naked. I don't care where were going but I'm buying a ticket for that one!!! Evil!

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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt

I'll say it again -- the NRA didn't hijack airliners and run them into buildings.

If this was an Arabic T-shirt with a political statement in a theater or supermarket, I might be more agreeable. But this was an airline. What we're talking about here is more along the lines of wearing a Nazi armband into a synagogue.

Cowgal raises a great point that people constantly forget. The Constitution constrains government -- not private business. Therefore, the airline was fully within its rights. TSA might be debatable, but private business can do what it wants. And before you bring up racial or sexual discrimination by employers, remember that those things are punishable as violation of federal law enacted to establish fairness in the workplace -- not denial of inherent Constitutional rights.

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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt

The passenger with the t-shirt was not denied passage on the plane, but simply asked to cover the t-shirt. Big deal. If I visit a Muslim country, as a woman I'm expected to completely cover up! Yes, even American women must abide by Muslim sharia law. Who can I sue???

A great number of airline passengers are inconvenienced for a large variety of reasons. I have 2 artificial metal knees. So guess what - every time I fly I set off the metal detector, and then I'm not only wanded (a handheld metal detector) but also completely patted down. A couple times I've had TSA agents growl at me when I've walked through the metal detectors and order me to remove anything metal. When I told them the metal is in my knees, they point blank said - no way - go back & remove all metal! I'm not elderly or in a wheelchair, so they immediately assumed I was making it up.

I try to take it all in stride, since I do feel the airlines and the TSA are trying to keep us safe. So the guy with the t-shirt does not get my sympathy, nor should he have received a settlement. He should have covered his shirt and shut-up.

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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt
Quote:
Expatriate wrote,
I'll say it again -- the NRA didn't hijack airliners and run them into buildings.

Neither did the average member of the Islamic community.
Both Nichols and McVeigh were Christians (supposedly) with right wing politics similar to mine. Does this mean I'm a danger to my community? I'm as abhorred by their actions as anyone else. Should I have to cover up my NRA t shirt or take off my hat ? No. Once again if someone is made to cover up a slogan on a T shirt just because the writing is in Arabic, farsi or whatever this is without a doubt a violation of the constitution and apparently the courts agreed. It wasn't worth what he got but his rights were violated just the same. Yes you can institute a dress code for a private business but it cannot descrimminate because of race, religion, sex, age, national origin or sexual preference. This did. No question about it.

Quote:
Cowgal wrote,
If I visit a Muslim country, as a woman I'm expected to completely cover up!

Yes you are. If you travel to places where the constitution doesn't apply you are expected to abide by their laws. Once again this is what sets us apart from lesser nations. Thank God you have a constitution and bill of rights and be prepared to defend it for all, not just some. This is the whole point of the document.

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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt

Once again...the Constitution doesn't apply in this case. Brick Wall,)

Asking this guy to cover up his T-shirt is no more a violation of Constitutional rights than a restaurant insisting that you wear a tie.

The Constitution does, however, specifically give me the right to keep and bear arms. Shall I sue the airline for not letting me take my Glock onboard? I'm guaranteed freedom of religion; does that mean I can take advantage of a captive audience and spend the flight delivering a sermon from the front of the cabin? The Fourth Amendment prohibits unreasonable search and seizure -- shall I sue because strangers are pawing my underwear and digging through the private things in my carry on without probable cause? What about that tube of toothpaste they confiscated without due process? Now they've violated my Fifth Amendment rights!

People have convinced you of a right that doesn't exist in order to take advantage, and you've bought into it hook, line, and sinker because you're afraid of looking intolerant.

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240,000 dollars awarded to man forced to cover Arab T-shirt

Expat wrote,

Quote:
Asking this guy to cover up his T-shirt is no more a violation of Constitutional rights than a restaurant insisting that you wear a tie.

As long as you enforce the rule across the board it's fine. If you own a business and want to say no one can wear a yellow and green T shirt in to my business it's perfectly acceptable as long as it's not based on religion, age, sex , sexual preference, national origin or race. He was the only one forced to cover his shirt and it was due to national origin/race as the writing that was considered offensive was arabic. This IS descrimination and a clear violation of the constitution. As I said before the courts agreed. If the writing had been in say Spanish or Chinese there would have been no issue. As there was it clearly violates the rights of this person. There is no question the decision was correct. The amount was ridiculous but the principal was right. Being a constitutionalist yourself I'm amazed we don't agree on this issue. This has nothing to do with my wanting to appear tolerant. I'm the guy who ruffled everyones feathers when I said "kill em all, let God sort em out remember? Are these the words of someone who's afraid of not looking tolerant? As far as bringing your glock onto a plane it;s perfectly acceptable to forbid it as long as you don't say "only arabs cant bring their glocks. Everyone else can. This is the difference and this is why the courts ruled it a violation.

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